[AusNOG] modern awards

[Michael Hobl]

Furthermore, it’s hard enough getting a good NE in this market even with a
high ceiling for compensation; any engineer worth their salt will already
command above-award rates, so an award doesn't help you address this.

Soft perks like workplace culture and flexible working, even little things
like parking, are going to be how you actually obtain (and retain) talented
minds.


- Michael


On Mon, Aug 29, 2022 at 10:58 AM Terry Sweetser <terry at ionetworks.com.au>
wrote:

> Hi Philip,
>
>
>
> Alas, this is where you will find a big gap in the structure of awards in
> Australia: very few Network Engineers qualify for IEAust/EA membership.
>
>
>
> Have a look at the Professional Employees Award:
>
>
>
> Refer to:
>
>
> https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/awards/awards-summary/ma000065-summary
>
>
>
> (Copy Pasta)
>
>
>
> The Professional Award covers employers mainly engaged in the information
> technology, medical research, quality auditing or telecommunications
> services industries and their employees who fit within the classifications
> of the award.
>
> Employees are also covered if they perform professional engineering and
> scientific duties, unless another award with a more appropriate
> classification covers their employer.
>
> The information technology industry means:
>
>    - designing and manufacturing computers, peripherals and software, and
>    telecommunications equipment
>    - installing, repairing and maintaining computer systems
>    - computer consultancy services
>    - computer programming
>    - system analysis services
>    - *designing, developing and maintaining online internet architecture
>    and facilitating online content management, or*
>    - work associated with any of the above.
>
>
>
>
> Who the Professional Award doesn’t cover
>
> The following employers and employees are not covered by the Professional
> Award:
>
>    - information technology employees who don’t have formal academic
>    qualifications or sufficient experience to be a Certified Professional of
>    the Australian Computer Society
>    - engineers who don’t have formal academic qualifications or
>    sufficient experience to be a member of Engineers Australia
>    - scientists who don’t have formal academic qualifications and don’t
>    qualify for membership in one of their professional bodies
>    - medical researchers who work for health services or higher education
>    organisations as defined in the award
>    - quality auditors who don’t satisfy the educational and experience
>    requirements set out in the award
>    - local government employees covered by another award
>    - employees who mainly do clerical and administrative work.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Terry Sweetser
>
>
> *Senior Engineer*
>
>
>
> *[image: cid2887060853*image009.png at 01D86AAE.9FCCEA10]*
>
>
> *Shop 1, Level 1, 9 Sherwood Rd, Toowong, 4066*
>
> e. terry.sweetser at ionetworks.com.au
> m. 0447 069 725
> p. 1300 124 816
> w. http://www.ionetworks.com.au
> <https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ionetworks.com.au%2F&data=05%7C01%7Ckumarbhaskar%40nbnco.com.au%7C0eadc264712b4751c66408da38699df8%7C947cb559a38041529eb5c7aaf41b194f%7C0%7C0%7C637884324895815038%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=5uS%2FNS7vyWOgKvZ4Chw87QMOAdNCylGwfUd2MnbOEDQ%3D&reserved=0>
>
> *Experience and Knowledge, On-Call.*
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *AusNOG <ausnog-bounces at ausnog.net> on behalf of Philip Loenneker <
> philip.loenneker at tasmanet.com.au>
> *Date: *Monday, 29 August 2022 at 8:17 am
> *To: *ausnog at ausnog.net <ausnog at ausnog.net>
> *Subject: *Re: [AusNOG] modern awards
>
> Terry – would you mind expanding on your comment that “The award does NOT
> cover technologists and engineers”? Are you suggesting that there is a more
> suitable award for Network Engineers?
>
>
>
> *From:* AusNOG <ausnog-bounces at ausnog.net> *On Behalf Of *Terry Sweetser
> *Sent:* Saturday, 27 August 2022 8:48 AM
> *To:* ausnog at ausnog.net
> *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] modern awards
>
>
>
> Some people who received this message don't often get email from
> terry at ionetworks.com.au. Learn why this is important
> <https://aka.ms/LearnAboutSenderIdentification>
>
>
>
> Hi NOGGERS,
>
>
>
> I suggest a quick look at:
> https://awardviewer.fwo.gov.au/award/show/MA000041#P1634_133943
>
>
>
> Applies (quoted):
>
>
>
> For the purposes of clause 4
> <https://awardviewer.fwo.gov.au/award/show/MA000041#P102_5334>* telecommunications
> services industry* means any business:
>
> *(a)* whose principal function is a telecommunications service carrier;or
>
> *(b)* whose principal function is a carriage service provider or a
> content service provider;or
>
> *(c)* whose principal function is the supply of telecommunications
> services including value added telecommunications services;or
>
> *(d)* whose principal function is incidental,ancillary or complementary
> to the businesses referred to in clauses 4.2(a)
> <https://awardviewer.fwo.gov.au/award/show/MA000041#P106_5805>,4.2(b)
> <https://awardviewer.fwo.gov.au/award/show/MA000041#P107_5876> and 4.2(c)
> <https://awardviewer.fwo.gov.au/award/show/MA000041#P108_5968>;or
>
> *(e)* which supplies labour to a business in the telecommunications
> services industry on a labour hire basis in respect of any such labour hire
> employees while engaged in the performance of work for a business in the
> telecommunications services industry.
>
> IANAL, but B and D look close “enough” for webhosting companies.  The
> award does NOT cover technologists and engineers.
>
>
>
> And of course, read the NES at
>
> https://www.fwc.gov.au/documents/awardmod/download/nes.pdf
>
>
>
>
>
> TCS
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *AusNOG <ausnog-bounces at ausnog.net> on behalf of Rob Thomas <
> xrobau at gmail.com>
> *Date: *Saturday, 27 August 2022 at 8:33 am
> *To: *Greg Lipschitz <glipschitz at summitinternet.com.au>
> *Cc: *ausnog at ausnog.net <ausnog at ausnog.net>
> *Subject: *Re: [AusNOG] modern awards
>
> Oh, and the link to download the actual PDF is
> https://portal.fairwork.gov.au/ArticleDocuments/872/business-equipment-award-ma000021-pay-guide.pdf.aspx
> - summary is $21.94 to $27.75.
>
>
>
> --Rob
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, 27 Aug 2022 at 08:30, Rob Thomas <xrobau at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I feel it's 100% on topic, and whilst I don't have any award employees
> here in au, EXTREMELY useful to know the right one to use when we need it!
>
>
>
> Thanks Greg and Nick.
>
>
>
> --Rob
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, 27 Aug 2022 at 08:17, Greg Lipschitz <
> glipschitz at summitinternet.com.au> wrote:
>
> Hi Nick
>
>
>
> I would have said that that is the wrong award as it’s for Retail. (Think
> shop assistant etc)
>
>
>
> Perhaps look at
> MA000021
>
>
>
> Examples of employees covered by the Business Equipment Award include:
>
>    - technical employees and technicians
>
>
> https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/awards/awards-summary/ma000021-summary
>
>
>
> That seems more appropriate.
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> *Greg Lipschitz**​*
>
>  |
>
> *Founder & CEO*
>
>  |
>
> *Summit Internet*
>
> *glipschitz at summitinternet.com.au* <glipschitz at summitinternet.com.au>
>
> *summitinternet.com.au* <http://summitinternet.com.au>
>
> *1300 049 749* <1300%20049%20749>
>
> *Unit 2, 31-39 Norcal Road, Nunawading VIC 3131*
> <https://www.google.com/maps?cid=12522583051503623677&_ga=2.149009334.1057584350.1554770858-1081443428.1554770858>
>
> [image: Summit Internet] <http://summitinternet.com.au/>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* AusNOG <ausnog-bounces at ausnog.net> on behalf of Nick Edwards <
> nick.z.edwards at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Friday, August 26, 2022 10:05:01 PM
> *To:* ausnog at ausnog.net <ausnog at ausnog.net>
> *Subject:* [AusNOG] modern awards
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
> Just been asked to ensure staff are paid at correct rates, I am satisfied
> they are, however one guy has questioned it, he's not making a fuss, but
> it's got me thinking, so I thought I'd ask the community here who surely
> would know, before I go contacting and waiting 3 months for a reply from
> FWA - before this dude just make a fuss :now we have a union run govt ->
>
> This is a webhosting company, only 6 employees, the guy is one of 3
> helpdesk tech support CSR's,  he questions he is in the correct award, we
> have him under MA000041 and cust contact  level 1 (he has no special
> qualifications and doesnt have server level access, your typical run of the
> mill tech support dude)
>
>
>
> Anyone see this as a problem?
>
> OFF list replies welcome, since I think this might exceed the list
> charter, to which I apologise for in advance.
>
> Ed
>
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