[AusNOG] RouterBoard

Paul Gear ausnog at libertysys.com.au
Mon Mar 10 15:03:57 EST 2014


I think Tony's suggestion of Cumulus + whitebox switches makes a lot 
more sense than building your own. So does VyOS/Vyatta on bare metal 
x86, although I don't think it would reach the performance levels of an 
embedded device (although don't quote me on that - I haven't tested it).

Paul

On 03/10/2014 01:59 PM, Alex Samad - Yieldbroker wrote:
>
> PFSense ... no cli then no.
>
> I think as a last resort I might look at building my own again.
>
> Alex
>
> *From:*Nathan Brookfield [mailto:Nathan.Brookfield at simtronic.com.au]
> *Sent:* Monday, 10 March 2014 2:57 PM
> *To:* Alex Samad - Yieldbroker; Matt Perkins; ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
> *Subject:* RE: [AusNOG] RouterBoard
>
> Zebra/Quagga has been around for a very long time and is a very stable 
> set of daemon's and the backend to Vyatta so any possible issue you 
> would have I am sure finding an answer online would be extremely 
> easy.  I think I have had one bug with it in the last 10 years and 
> that was when 4 byte ASN's came mainstream and that is long fixed.
>
> PFSense is more a Firewall than a router, it does not have a CLI 
> either from my experience. I love it as an edge firewall ,t is 
> extremely efficient and reliable but short of a Gateway I would not 
> use it for routing at the DC.
>
> *From:*Alex Samad - Yieldbroker [mailto:Alex.Samad at yieldbroker.com]
> *Sent:* Monday, 10 March 2014 2:54 PM
> *To:* Nathan Brookfield; Matt Perkins; ausnog at lists.ausnog.net 
> <mailto:ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
> *Subject:* RE: [AusNOG] RouterBoard
>
> Tempting, time ?
>
> Had a look at zebra and a very very quick look at bird.
>
> The other issue is support.
>
> A few people have suggested pfsense, it looks interesting, I think I 
> looked at this a while back, but can't remember why I didn't proceed 
> further.
>
> Alex
>
> *From:*AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] *On Behalf Of 
> *Nathan Brookfield
> *Sent:* Monday, 10 March 2014 2:48 PM
> *To:* Matt Perkins; ausnog at lists.ausnog.net 
> <mailto:ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] RouterBoard
>
> If you're finding you can do everything in Linux why not just throw 
> Zebra or Bird into the mix and solve your issues that way?
>
> *From:*AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] *On Behalf Of 
> *Matt Perkins
> *Sent:* Monday, 10 March 2014 2:43 PM
> *To:* ausnog at lists.ausnog.net <mailto:ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] RouterBoard
>
> My opinion and we have been using CCR's since the first one arrived in 
> Australia is they are reasonable kit.   Overall I find the performance 
> and price excellent. But there have been just to many unexplained 
> problems for my liking. Not that we dont still use them on the edge we 
> do. Im about to roll one out to quite a far destination over the next 
> week. But the site has a backup and it is non essential.  They are not 
> ready for the core and they are not ready for a network that needs 4 
> 9's   Perhaps we are at 99.9 now. Then again if I had to run on a 
> tight budget and I had the opportunity to trade off reliability. It 
> would be the number one on my list.
>
> Speed
> Reliability
> Price
>
> Pick any 3 CCR's fit in to the Speed and Price corner of the triangle.
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> On 10/03/14 2:04 PM, Alex Samad - Yieldbroker wrote:
>
>     Hi
>
>     Yeah I have read a bit about the single core issues on the CCR,
>     the last time I looked because of this I saw 3 cpu's floating
>     around 30-60% non-maxed
>
>     I started this by looking at VM routers, but I couldn't get pas
>     the 1Gb/s nic. There is Brocades vyatta, but its just way to
>     expensive compared to routeros
>
>     My constraints are more along the lines of, I have core switching
>     already, I wanted to add some core routing.
>
>     I am happy with the CCR on $$ on CLI
>
>     I am not so happy about the current performance, be that limited
>     to my testing via iperf...  I am nearly ready to live with that,
>     on the presumption I can get 8+Gbs with multi stream tcp.
>
>     My current risk is support, especially as I have had a hard time
>     working through this CCR performance issue.  I don't want to roll
>     out 2 of these at each DC and then run into a bug, where the only
>     solution is to throw it away.  I can duplicate about all the
>     functionality of routeros on linux apart from BGP and OSPF. And I
>     am guessing if I looked really hard and spent some time I could
>     get that working as well.
>
>     So taking into account their low $$ I can also live with minimal
>     support if I have another hardware solution to match up with it on
>     a similar $$ level.  If they can talk iBGP, OSPF and VRRP, then I
>     am just about set. J
>
>     So I thought I would dig into the knowledge pool that is AUSNOG
>     and find out what other devices like RouterOS are being used..
>
>     Alex
>
>     *From:*AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] *On Behalf
>     Of *Tom Berryman
>     *Sent:* Monday, 10 March 2014 1:45 PM
>     *To:* David Bomba; Damian Guppy
>     *Cc:* ausnog at lists.ausnog.net <mailto:ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
>     *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] RouterBoard
>
>     David is correct, the Tilera CPU with RouterOS does struggle with
>     single threaded processes -- worse than just BGP operating on a
>     single core, all routing (OSPF, RIP and static) processing will
>     happen on the same core. ROS7 is likely to change this (rumours).
>
>     But still, the CCR range has forced a lot of people to change how
>     they think about routing (at a relatively small scale) -- and has
>     certainly bought the cost down. "Routed" packets per dollar, I
>     don't think anything in the new hardware market can compete.
>
>     Vyatta has other challenges like x86 PCI architecture that will
>     limit your total throughput -- however things like processing BGP
>     are drastically improved compared to ROS. Ubiquity has ported the
>     Vyatta/VyOS to MIPS processors, possibly worth a look but I don't
>     think it has any SFP+.
>
>     Given Alex's application -- storage -- a layer 3 solution is not
>     likely to be the best.
>
>     Alex, have you considered something like the Brocade VDX Ethernet
>     fabric (VDX could enable 40g native interfaces)? Or at least other
>     layer 2 solutions? I noticed that you have tried routing on
>     switches (Dell) perhaps something with some more power with this
>     design would yield better results for you?
>
>     Tom
>
>     **
>
>     *From:*AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] *On Behalf
>     Of *David Bomba
>     *Sent:* Monday, 10 March 2014 12:32 PM
>     *To:* Damian Guppy
>     *Cc:* ausnog at lists.ausnog.net <mailto:ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
>     *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] RouterBoard
>
>     I believe he has the CCR1036-8G-2S+ which has 2x10GB SFP+ ports.
>
>     I think the issue he is hitting is the single threaded nature of
>     routerOS for a lot of its functionality.
>
>     BGP, for instance spins on a single core. Until ROS becomes
>     multi-core aware/capable a lot of its functionality will be capped
>     at the per core performance.
>
>     On 10 March 2014 12:26, Damian Guppy <the.damo at gmail.com
>     <mailto:the.damo at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>         CCR1036 has no 10G ports, only 1G, so im not sure why you
>         would expect to get a single TCP stream past 1G (even with
>         LACP since that is not how LACP works)
>
>         --Damian
>
>         On Mon, Mar 10, 2014 at 6:58 AM, Alex Samad - Yieldbroker
>         <Alex.Samad at yieldbroker.com
>         <mailto:Alex.Samad at yieldbroker.com>> wrote:
>
>             Hi
>
>
>             So I have tested routerOS ... in VM and also bought the
>             ccr1036.
>
>             I'm not 100% happy with the ccr1036.  Basically can't push
>             1 tcp stream past 1Gb/s I can get 8-9Gb/s with multiple
>             streams. I can get UDP up to 9.8Gb/s
>
>             I like routerOS interface (have to admit I like the vyatta
>             better from what I saw).
>
>             But now I need to find something similar to these devices
>             around the same price and around the same performance, I
>             would like to push it all to a VM but Brocade want my 1st
>             and 2nd child ...
>
>             So routerOS support is nowhere close to Cisco and rightly
>             so for the price, so I have some hesitancy in rolling
>             these things out, especially if they are going into the core.
>
>             So are there any suggestions from the list ?
>
>             Alex
>
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> -- 
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