[AusNOG] Global switch Level 4 Hard disk's
Tony de Francesco
tonyd at pue.com.au
Mon Jan 13 18:48:02 EST 2014
Sorry just had look and they use a pre-action system that is supplemented
with Inergen, which woukd have allowed a reduced Inergen volume.
Regards
Tony de Francesco
Technical Director
P.U.E. Pty Ltd
Mob: +61 (0) 457 701 179
Email: tonyd at pue.com.au
On 13/01/2014 6:40 PM, "Matt Perkins" <matt at spectrum.com.au> wrote:
> Global switches incident report states that the use inergen
> Matt
>
>
>
> --
> /* Matt Perkins
> Direct 1300 137 379 Spectrum Networks Ptd. Ltd.
> Office 1300 133 299 matt at spectrum.com.au
> Fax 1300 133 255 Level 6, 350 George Street Sydney 2000
> SIP 1300137379 at sip.spectrum.com.au
> Google Talk MattAPerkins at gmail.com
> PGP/GNUPG Public Key can be found at http://pgp.mit.edu
> */
>
> On 13 Jan 2014, at 18:38, Matt Carter <mattc at mansol.net.au> wrote:
>
> No more space than you need for a air handling room a ups room or some
> twin turbo v16 generators ;) if you had a hand in building it from the slab
> of course ;) eg iseek has always used inergen and as far as I'm aware will
> continue to do so .
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 13 Jan 2014, at 17:36, "Tony de Francesco" <tonyd at pue.com.au> wrote:
>
> Given the floor plate sizes at Global Switch you'll probably find they
> use FM200.
>
> Inergen is typically used in smalller DCs because of the volume of gas
> that is required (and the resulting flopr space requirements to house it),
> not necessarily because of cost.
>
> Regards
>
> Tony de Francesco
> Technical Director
> P.U.E. Pty Ltd
> Mob: +61 (0) 457 701 179
> Email: tonyd at pue.com.au
> On 13/01/2014 6:17 PM, "Joshua D'Alton" <joshua at railgun.com.au> wrote:
>
>> Suffice to say it still isn't recommended to actually sustain breathing
>> in such an environment, but the couple minutes it could take you to vacate
>> a DC (or affected area) you'll do fine breathing that. Possibly not so much
>> those with asthma or lung issues, but you shouldn't pass out or the like.
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 13, 2014 at 5:57 PM, Ben Buxton <bb.ausnog at bb.cactii.net>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> The volume discharged is calculated such that residual O2 remains (about
>>> 10% v/v). The CO2 is intended to induce a physiological reaction which
>>> causes you to breath heavier to compensate.
>>>
>>> There's probably a page describing the reasoning behind the numbers
>>> (wikipedia maybe?)
>>>
>>> BB
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 13, 2014 at 5:53 PM, Tony de Francesco <tonyd at pue.com.au>wrote:
>>>
>>>> And last time I drew a breathe I could not live on a mixture of 52%
>>>> nitrogen, 40% argon and 8% carbon dioxide.
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>>
>>>> Tony de Francesco
>>>> Technical Director
>>>> P.U.E. Pty Ltd
>>>> Mob: +61 (0) 457 701 179
>>>> Email: tonyd at pue.com.au
>>>> On 13/01/2014 5:45 PM, "Tony de Francesco" <tonyd at pue.com.au> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Yes but Inergen is not used in large DCs because of the volume
>>>>> required.
>>>>>
>>>>> The European system is a hypoxic system at low pressure. Very
>>>>> different to dumping a whole bunch of gas through high pressure nozzles.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>>
>>>>> Tony de Francesco
>>>>> Technical Director
>>>>> P.U.E. Pty Ltd
>>>>> Mob: +61 (0) 457 701 179
>>>>> Email: tonyd at pue.com.au
>>>>> On 13/01/2014 5:33 PM, "Ben Buxton" <bb.ausnog at bb.cactii.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Inergen is an inert system. It's just Nitrogen, Argon and CO2,
>>>>>> perfectly safe for humans to breath the resulting atmosphere
>>>>>> post-discharge, as it still contains enough oxygen to support life but not
>>>>>> fire.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> BB
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Jan 13, 2014 at 5:22 PM, Tony de Francesco <tonyd at pue.com.au>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Not all data centres use fire supression gases like FM200 or
>>>>>>> Inergen, although the Australian DC market seems hooked on these gas
>>>>>>> solutions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Such systems are actually banned throughout much of Europe where
>>>>>>> instead they deploy an oxygen reduction system, which operates by filling
>>>>>>> the room with an inert gas to reduce the oxygen levels in order to stop a
>>>>>>> fire but still support human life (with no effect on electrical equipment!).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tony de Francesco
>>>>>>> Technical Director
>>>>>>> P.U.E. Pty Ltd
>>>>>>> On 13/01/2014 4:22 PM, "Jared Hirst" <
>>>>>>> jared.hirst at serversaustralia.com.au> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Must be a very good reason, they have 100+ DC's all the same :(
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: Nathan Brookfield [mailto:Nathan.Brookfield at simtronic.com.au]
>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, January 13, 2014 4:21 PM
>>>>>>>> To: Jared Hirst; Joseph Goldman; ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
>>>>>>>> Subject: RE: [AusNOG] Global switch Level 4 Hard disk's
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yeah so it just means when/if a fire starts your equipment is
>>>>>>>> completely
>>>>>>>> SCREWED instead of just some blown drives. I wouldn't say this is
>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>> advantage at all.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kindest Regards,
>>>>>>>> Nathan Brookfield (VK2NAB)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Chief Executive Officer
>>>>>>>> Simtronic Technologies Pty Ltd
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Local: (02) 4749 4949 | Fax: (02) 4749 4950 | Direct: (02) 4749 4951
>>>>>>>> Web: http://www.simtronic.com.au | E-mail:
>>>>>>>> nathan.brookfield at simtronic.com.au
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>> Jared
>>>>>>>> Hirst
>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, 13 January 2014 4:17 PM
>>>>>>>> To: Joseph Goldman; ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Global switch Level 4 Hard disk's
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> " but the generality of the fault means it could happen in any
>>>>>>>> major data
>>>>>>>> center really."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Wouldn't happen in Equinix... They use Dry Pipe and manual fire
>>>>>>>> supression
>>>>>>>> to alleviate any 'accidental' systems going off :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I would class that as a pretty major Data Centre.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>> Joseph
>>>>>>>> Goldman
>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, January 13, 2014 4:15 PM
>>>>>>>> To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Global switch Level 4 Hard disk's
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's not quite so funny when you realise some people may have hours
>>>>>>>> - or
>>>>>>>> days - worth of headache's ahead of them restoring back to
>>>>>>>> production.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It is an odd circumstance, and one that I would not have thought of
>>>>>>>> personally in risk mitigation (beyond accounting for fire anyway).
>>>>>>>> Are
>>>>>>>> there drives rated against this kind of 'shock'? Obviously one
>>>>>>>> should have
>>>>>>>> Disaster Recovery in place, as the gas suppression going off may
>>>>>>>> indicate
>>>>>>>> your servers being doused in fire and unusable anyway, but when one
>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>> avoid DR one would, and I'd rather not break on a false positive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Luckily I don't use Global Switch, but the generality of the fault
>>>>>>>> means
>>>>>>>> it could happen in any major data center really.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 13/01/14 16:08, Tim March wrote:
>>>>>>>> > Lol. Awesome.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > So, does the incident report look something like;
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > 12:01 "CCTV records HVAC maintenance punter smoking cigarette"
>>>>>>>> > 12:03 "Suppression system dumps
>>>>>>>> 987165128973465891723412352643345^2
>>>>>>>> > liters of gas in to machine room in ~ 0.000000001675 seconds"
>>>>>>>> > 12:03 "Sonic boom recorded at BOM monitoring station 50km from
>>>>>>>> facility"
>>>>>>>> > 12:04 *picture of engineer crying / HDD parts strewn all over
>>>>>>>> floor*
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > T.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > On 13/01/14 3:22 PM, Pinkerton, Eric (AU Sydney) wrote:
>>>>>>>> >> It's not unheard of, it's to do with the noise created when the
>>>>>>>> fire
>>>>>>>> suppression system deploys...
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> http://www.bvfa.de/pdf-download/en-3/
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> http://www.buildingtechnologies.siemens.com/bt/global/en/firesafety/e
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> xtinguishing/about-sinorix/latest-technical-findings/Documents/White_
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> Paper_Potential%20damage%20to%20hard%20disk%20drives%20during%20disch
>>>>>>>> >> arges_en_September2012.pdf
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> There is even a market for nozzles on fire suppression systems
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> lowers the sound in order to prevent this happening..
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> See the WWW.FIKE.COM PROINERT(r) HUSH NOZZLES
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> >> From: AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf
>>>>>>>> Of
>>>>>>>> >> Matt Perkins
>>>>>>>> >> Sent: Monday, 13 January 2014 2:26 PM
>>>>>>>> >> To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
>>>>>>>> >> Subject: [AusNOG] Global switch Level 4 Hard disk's
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> Hi All,
>>>>>>>> >> I have quite a few people today with hard drives fail in
>>>>>>>> suites on
>>>>>>>> level 4 at global switch. GS tell us the Gas was dropped in
>>>>>>>> response to
>>>>>>>> some smoke from some plant. Not sure how inergen would effect hard
>>>>>>>> drives
>>>>>>>> but there are many people wondering around on level 4 looking like
>>>>>>>> there
>>>>>>>> dog just died.
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> Anybody have any more info.
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> Matt
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> --
>>>>>>>> >> /* Matt Perkins
>>>>>>>> >> Direct 1300 137 379 Spectrum Networks Ptd. Ltd.
>>>>>>>> >> Office 1300 133 299 matt at spectrum.com.au
>>>>>>>> >> Fax 1300 133 255 Level 6, 350 George Street
>>>>>>>> Sydney
>>>>>>>> 2000
>>>>>>>> >> SIP 1300137379 at sip.spectrum.com.au
>>>>>>>> >> PGP/GNUPG Public Key can be found at
>>>>>>>> http://pgp.mit.edu */
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> >> AusNOG mailing list
>>>>>>>> >> AusNOG at lists.ausnog.net
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>>>>>>>> >> AusNOG mailing list
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>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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