[AusNOG] ADSL2+ line sync data

[Mark ZZZ Smith]

----- Original Message -----
> From: Joseph Goldman <joe at apcs.com.au>
> To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
> Cc: 
> Sent: Sunday, 15 September 2013 2:35 PM
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] ADSL2+ line sync data
> 
> For most RSP's who buy transit at a 1:1 ratio, unless they happen to 
> offset a lot of bandwidth with content hosting, then you tend to have a 
> lot of spare upload spare anyway. I wouldn't see the problem in 
> symmetric uploads being sold. Obviously each RSP can have T&C's to state 
> 
> abuse and what can/can't be hosted at home (i.e. a big shared hosting 
> company can't be hosted off your 50/50 NBN Tail)
> 

Assuming the existing NBN model/services, an RSP/ISP could buy 100/40 or 50/20 services from NBNco, but then on the BNG/BRAS, shape (not police) the downstream service bandwidth to be equal to the upstream bandwidth, so that their service bandwidths were 40/40 or 20/20. They'd then need less CVC and Internet transit capacity, and therefore should be able to offer these services significantly cheaper that their competitors 100/40 or 50/20 services (simplistically, the 40/40 service could be 60% cheaper than their competitors 100/40 service).

> 
> On 15/09/13 13:56, Mark ZZZ Smith wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>>>  From: grenville armitage <garmitage at swin.edu.au>
>>>  To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
>>>  Cc:
>>>  Sent: Saturday, 14 September 2013 11:22 AM
>>>  Subject: Re: [AusNOG] ADSL2+ line sync data
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>  On 09/14/2013 10:15, Mark ZZZ Smith wrote:
>>>       [..]
>>>>    It's the ratio of downstream to update bandwidth that 
> matters, and
>>>>    the likelihood of congestion in the upstream direction, not so 
> much
>>>>    the bandwidth involved. The greater the ratio of downstream to
>>>>    upstream bandwidth, the more likely the problem is going to 
> occur.
>>>  +1
>>> 
>>>  (Seriously, Mark is right about http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3449. 
> Still
>>>  relevant in our brave new asymmetric high speed world.)
>>>   
>> 
>>  Where I most think it matters is that the service speeds people buy sets, 
> quite reasonably, their expectations of what they'll be able to get out of 
> their service.
>> 
>>  So if a customer buys a 25/5 service for example, they'd expect that 
> they'd be able to upload at 5Mbps while also downloading at 25Mbps. They 
> probably won't be able to due to bandwidth asymmetry, which means that the 
> ISP/RSP may be violating trade practices laws for false advertising. Or in the 
> least, the ISP/RSP have to deal with customer complaints.
>> 
>>  OTOH, if the ISP/RSP provided 25/25, then it is possible to both upload and 
> download using TCP at full rates in both directions.
>> 
>>  In the brave new NBN world, where people have data centers in their 
> basement, are uploading X-rays from their iPhone 9, and streaming 4K security 
> camera video of their cat to the Internet, I think the consequences of this 
> asymmetry are going to become are more visible.
>> 
>> 
>>  Regards,
>> 
>>  Mark.
>> 
>>>  cheers,
>>>  gja
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