[AusNOG] Trouble with an ex-Customer

Tue May 7 20:33:15 EST 2013

Wouldn't this simply put fuel on an already well burning fire? (if they
were on the list)

On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 8:31 PM, Skeeve Stevens <
skeeve+ausnog at eintellegonetworks.com> wrote:

> I don't think so.  Even so... why should I care?
>
>
> ...Skeeve
>
> *Skeeve Stevens - *eintellego Networks Pty Ltd
> skeeve at eintellegonetworks.com ; www.eintellegonetworks.com
>
> Phone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve
>
> facebook.com/eintellegonetworks ;  <http://twitter.com/networkceoau>
> linkedin.com/in/skeeve
>
> twitter.com/networkceoau ; blog: www.network-ceo.net
>
>
> The Experts Who The Experts Call
> Juniper - Cisco - Cloud
>
>
> On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 8:26 PM, Jared Hirst <
> jared.hirst at serversaustralia.com.au> wrote:
>
>> Is said customer on this list?
>>
>>
>> On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 8:20 PM, Skeeve Stevens <
>> skeeve+ausnog at eintellegonetworks.com> wrote:
>>
>>> So,
>>>
>>> This is a new one for me.... and I'd like to know what the community
>>> thinks about this situation.
>>>
>>> Background first...
>>>
>>> We have an ex-client, a micro ISP who has been very hard to deal with
>>> over the time we've been involved with them.
>>>
>>> Basically, They've been a customer for over a year, but only on a
>>> minimal basis.  We offered them a higher level of service - even offered to
>>> let them try it out for a couple of weeks for free before signing up to the
>>> new level.  They seemed happy, and at the agreed upon date we asked them to
>>> sign the agreement and can we issue the invoice.  They agreed to the
>>> issuing of the invoice and then we sent the paperwork to them a little
>>> later.
>>>
>>> Life goes on for a couple of weeks, and we're getting no response to
>>> questions about the agreement or to overdue notices - while still
>>> delivering them the service.  They request a meeting, and we agree... The
>>> customer has some new staff who were quite arrogant, abusive, and question
>>> everything we've ever done - even though they have no idea about this
>>> industry or how it works.
>>>
>>> We don't appreciate being abused, so we say we'd rather not do business
>>> with them anymore and suspend their support services with us the next day
>>> due to the non-payment of their account.  All good and normal.
>>>
>>>
>>> So a few days later they come at us with legal letters claiming we've
>>> locked them out of some devices - which we haven't - we ceased doing any
>>> work for them immediately.  We explained that we would help them with
>>> whatever they needed - if all they did was pay their overdue invoices.
>>>  They could do anything they needed themselves, but they are just clueless.
>>>
>>> Now, this has been dragging on for a few weeks with letters between
>>> lawyers, with them claiming all sort of bizarre things.  My stance is that
>>> 'without paying their invoice, we're not doing any work for them at all...
>>> no handover, no anything'.  I am not in the habit of being bullied into
>>> doing work for people - nasty letters or not.  They also threatened they'd
>>> gone to the NSW Police Cyber Crime unit... who I called, and they just
>>> basically shrugged their shoulders and said they'd received nothing yet but
>>> will let me know if they do.
>>>
>>> Today we informed them that we will be deleting all information that we
>>> hold of theirs in a few days (all documentation, etc).  I don't really want
>>> to put us at any further risk by having access to their information -
>>> whether it is still current or not.  We're completely within our rights as
>>> we have no legal requirements to keep anything for them.
>>>
>>> So, an hour or so ago I got a call from my lawyer.  He was contacted by
>>> a detective at the Kings Cross police station.  Apparently they ex-customer
>>> has gone to the cops and made some claims and a detective seemed to think
>>> that their claim may be valid under Section 308E of the NSW Crimes Act<http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/ca190082/s308e.html>
>>>
>>> The reason I am posting here is to draw on the communities experience of
>>> these kinds of things.  I've not heard of the NSW Police getting involved
>>> in these things, especially at the local station level... but it seems they
>>> are.  I think that they are just using the Police to attempt to intimidate
>>> me into doing work for him... but I won't tolerate that.  I am more than
>>> happy to let them arrest me and let the DPP figure out how to prove their
>>> case against me.
>>>
>>> Firstly, my lawyer agrees that they can't compel us to do work for them
>>> without paying.  I also believe that under the Act above, that we haven't
>>> "impaired" (by the Act's definition) anything by not giving them any
>>> information or knowledge we have.  The lawyers agree.
>>>
>>> My view here is that they are free to go to any consultants anywhere...
>>> hire who they like, but I am not going to be pressured into doing work for
>>> them without them a) paying any unpaid invoices, or b) paying for any new
>>> work they want, such as handover, etc.
>>>
>>> This is a frustrating situation as over the time we've been involved
>>> with this customer he has been abusive and used very violent language in
>>> his dramatic outbursts about completely bizarre things (like us expecting
>>> him to read his email).
>>>
>>> I am sure some will say I shouldn't be discussing this here, but this
>>> bullshit of going to the cops because I won't do work for him without him
>>> paying his bills, is a new depth of stupidness I didn't think even they
>>> would go to.
>>>
>>> So I am wondering if anyone else here has had these sort of intimidation
>>> tactics used against them in this sort of context.
>>>
>>> If you have advice, but want to send it off-list, feel free.
>>>
>>>
>>> ...Skeeve
>>>
>>> *Skeeve Stevens - *eintellego Networks Pty Ltd
>>> skeeve at eintellegonetworks.com ; www.eintellegonetworks.com
>>>
>>> Phone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve
>>>
>>> facebook.com/eintellegonetworks ;  <http://twitter.com/networkceoau>
>>> linkedin.com/in/skeeve
>>>
>>> twitter.com/networkceoau ; blog: www.network-ceo.net
>>>
>>>
>>> The Experts Who The Experts Call
>>> Juniper - Cisco - Cloud
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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