[AusNOG] Domestic Peering WAS: Vocus peering traffic missingfrom PIPE-IX?

[Mark Smith]

The thing that makes me think T/O/A wouldn't meet that is the "facilities capable of terminating IP customer leased line connections" part - I think facilities is general enough of a word that it starts to imply at least a local sales office, local telco license, have a registered business and submit tax returns, ability to do LI etc. So O/T and maybe A might meet the presence requirement by having a router in a rack, would they be "established" enough in those countries for Verizon to consider them a "regional peer" (in the peer=equal) sense.

Assuming Verizon are willing to overlook their own geographical requirements, the question is whether they're currently benefiting from or being disadvantaged by their "GoF" membership. If they're being disadvantaged enough, they'd probably also be advocates for breaking it up.

----- Original Message -----
> From: Mark Prior <mrp at mrp.net>
> To: Mark Smith <markzzzsmith at yahoo.com.au>
> Cc: Matthew Moyle-Croft <mmc at mmc.com.au>; Chris Ricks <chris.ricks at securepay.com.au>; "ausnog at lists.ausnog.net" <ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
> Sent: Monday, 12 November 2012 7:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Domestic Peering WAS: Vocus peering traffic missingfrom PIPE-IX?
> 
>T he policy document seems pretty clear to me that there are general 
> operational requirements (sections 2 & 3) and requirements specific to 
> the region/country (section 1).
> 
> Mark.
> 
> On 12/11/12 6:36 PM, Mark Smith wrote:
>>  Yeah, I know, used to work for them when they were called UUNet/Worldcom.  
> That policy reads like it applies to all of 701, 702 and 703.
>> 
>>>  ________________________________
>>>  From: Mark Prior <mrp at mrp.net>
>>>  To: Mark Smith <markzzzsmith at yahoo.com.au>
>>>  Cc: Matthew Moyle-Croft <mmc at mmc.com.au>; Chris Ricks 
> <chris.ricks at securepay.com.au>; "ausnog at lists.ausnog.net" 
> <ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
>>>  Sent: Monday, 12 November 2012 6:04 PM
>>>  Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Domestic Peering WAS: Vocus peering traffic 
> missingfrom PIPE-IX?
>>> 
>>>  AS703 = Verizon Asia Pacific
>>> 
>>>  Mark.
>>> 
>>>  On 12/11/12 4:47 PM, Mark Smith wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>  ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>  From: Matthew Moyle-Croft <mmc at mmc.com.au>
>>>>>  To: Chris Ricks <chris.ricks at securepay.com.au>
>>>>>  Cc: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
>>>>>  Sent: Monday, 12 November 2012 3:32 PM
>>>>>  Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Domestic Peering WAS: Vocus peering 
> traffic missingfrom PIPE-IX?
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>  On 11/11/2012, at 8:29 PM, Chris Ricks 
> <chris.ricks at securepay.com.au>
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>>      There's been on list discussion stating that if the 
> other 3 members of
>>>>>>      the GoF were evaluated using Verizon's published 
> policy, they
>>>>>  wouldn't
>>>>>>      get to keep the current arrangement - do you have an 
> opinion on that
>>>>>>      either way?
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>  I'd suggest that untrue.  All would meet AS703s 
> requirements.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>  I wouldn't have thought Telstra, Optus or AAPT can meet the 
> following -
>>>> 
>>>>  Geographic Scope. The Requester shall operate facilities capable of 
> terminating IP customer leased line connections onto a device in at least 50% of 
> the geographic region in which the Verizon Business Internet Network with which 
> it desires to interconnect operates such facilities. This currently equates to 
> 25 states in the United States, 9 countries in Europe, or 3 countries in the 
> Asia-Pacific region. The Requester also must have a geographically-dispersed 
> network. In the United States, at a minimum, the Requester must have a backbone 
> node in each of the following eight geographic regions: Northeast; Mid-Atlantic; 
> Southeast; North Central; South Central; Northwest; Mid-Pacific; and Southwest.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>  Obviously Verizon can choose to break their own rules if it 
> benefits them.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>>  MMC
>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>      On 12/11/12 15:13, Mark Prior wrote:
>>>>>>>      On 12/11/12 12:25 PM, Chris Ricks wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>      Even if a merger of M2, iiNet and TPG occurred, 
> their traffic
>>>>>  volume
>>>>>>>>      would not put them in a position to discuss 
> settlement-free or SKA
>>>>>>>>      peering with any of the GoF without government 
> intervention - that
>>>>>  is
>>>>>>>>      the crux of the issue here.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>      I wouldn't put Verizon in the same box as the 
> other three. They
>>>>>  have a
>>>>>>>      written peering policy and if you satisfy the 
> policy via a test
>>>>>>>      peering then you get to keep it.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>      AAPT had a policy (I wrote the first version :-) 
> but it's a moving
>>>>>>>      target, at least it was when I last tried to use it 
> to get peering.
>>>>>>>      Telstra's peering policy is mission impossible 
> and Optus can't
>>>>>  spell
>>>>>>>      peering.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>      Mark.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>      AusNOG mailing list
>>>>>>     AusNOG at lists.ausnog.net
>>>>>>     http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog
>>>>> 
>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>  AusNOG mailing list
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>>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>