[AusNOG] Vocus vs. Pipe - Was: Vocus peering traffic missingfrom PIPE-IX?

[Sean K. Finn]

Peering costs us more than transit, especially when we have intercapital transit from BNE to SYD just to pick up Equinix.

What multilateral peering does give us is a higher selection of paths to chose from to all of the other people at the exchanges.

I would get more MBPS if i consolidated my spend with a single provider but it's better to have more connection points than less.

Indeed for many years we went without peering because our network had enough capacity without it.

What it DOES provide is direct low latency interconnects to other Australian providers, and, considering most of our traffic stays within Australia, it's worth having to increase performance.

Peering won't ever go away, but is something that you have on top of good transit providers.

On 09/11/2012, at 6:06 AM, "Mark Smith" <markzzzsmith at yahoo.com.au> wrote:

> The assertion was peering is free / gratis / no money. That's clearly incorrect, and I don't think you need much more than a simplification to realise it.
> 
> It's worth remembering that the actual definition of the word "peer" is
> 
> "a person who is the same age or has the same social position or the same abilities as other people in a group" 
> 
> i.e. an *equal* based on a set of attributes.
> 
> Using Verizon as an example, Verizon's peering T&Cs list who they consider to be somebody they'd be willing to directly peer with, with lower requirements in ASPAC verses the rest of the world. However, I doubt even Telstra would qualify, so it's likely that Verizon also would like to get out of the so-called Gang of Four arrangement, because they're being forced to peer with non-equals. Telstra would probably have the same view on Optus and AAPT, and Optus on AAPT. Considering that AAPT is no where near as big as the other 3 they'd be gaining the most and providing the least.
> 
> Multilateral peering doesn't require the "peers" to be apparent equals, however it is aggregating together the value the small "peers" would provide such that there is value to the larger "peers" to connect. Everybody who connects gains more from connecting than it costs them. Those who choose not to connect, in their judgement, don't gain more from it than it would cost them, despite the many values of peering that Sam Silvester pointed out, other than just "cheaper than transit".
> 
> Government forced peering means that some parties can get far more value out of the arrangement than others - it isn't mutually beneficial to everybody any more, in their individual perception. If forced peering became the norm, could I force my residential ISP to peer with my home network, "for free"? If big networks must peer with smaller networks, then my home network qualifies as a small one.
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Bevan Slattery <bevan at slattery.net.au>
>> To: Mark Smith <markzzzsmith at yahoo.com.au>; Luke Iggleden <luke+ausnog at sisgroup.com.au>
>> Cc: "ausnog at lists.ausnog.net" <ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>
>> Sent: Thursday, 8 November 2012 2:12 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Vocus vs. Pipe - Was: Vocus peering traffic missingfrom PIPE-IX?
>> 
>> And those that want to peer don't?
>> 
>> TPG, iiNet and Nextgen are larger than AAPT and Verizon.  In fact TPG and
>> iiNet are larger than Optus in the ADSL market.
>> 
>> Oversimplification me thinks...
>> 
>> [b]
>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> So the rack space, cable infrastructure, routers, electricity, 24x7 NOC
>>> etc. that you use to connect to them, *if* you qualify as a peer, is all
>>> free?
>>> 
>>> Think about it. A company spends millions of dollars on equipment and
>>> installs fibre across Australia, and is then going to let everybody use
>>> it for gratis? That's a business plan to very rapidly go out of 
>> business.
>>> I suspect the "free peering" myth has come from the days when 
>> residential
>>> ADSL offered "free Pipe". The only reason it was "free" 
>> to customers was
>>> that the ISP chose not to bill the customers for it.
>> 
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