[AusNOG] IPv6 Article on CNN
Shane Short
shane at short.id.au
Mon May 31 07:44:44 EST 2010
I agree with everything you've said here, bar the doomsday articles.
The problem with doomsday articles is that some people will read them as such and completely ignore them.
On 31/05/2010, at 5:40 AM, Skeeve Stevens wrote:
> That is the thing... do you realise how many ISP’s are just sitting there doing nothing right now?
>
> Every conversation I am having with ISP’s ends up sounding doomsday-like because:
> - v4 run-out is happening 12-24 months from now
> - You need 3-6 months to get engineering staff up to speed
> - You need another 3 or more to get sales/management up to speed
> - You need to be kicking your transit suppliers, hardware vendors and so on
> - You need to figure out how to deal with the fact that few customer xDSL CPE’s are going to work and who is going to pay for it
> - You need to be planning for the serious architectural changes to your network
> o IPv6 dual-stack transit
> o IPv6 your core
> o IPv6 your OSS (including all the investigation/upgrading this will take)
> o IPv6 to you customers – colo, ethernet, cloud, hosting for the most part is easy – DSL isn’t as easy
> o You need to buy/build/integrate CGN/LSN
> o This will need 6-9 months effort
> - You need to plan how to pay for it – NOW
> - Decide that if you want to keep your job (if you aren’t the owner – then it is your business you will lose) if you don’t start making SOME moves – even if it is just understanding and planning what you should be doing... talking to someone – anyone who can help.
>
> If ISPs don’t do the above... and start in the next 3 months, then things are going to get very bad for you if you are an ISP.
>
> Few people can deny most of the above. If you do, you are not an ISP or living in a fantasy world.
>
> Even at CeBIT, because of what we do, a LOT of people we were talking to were ISPs – and nearly all of them haven’t even thought about starting IPv6 yet.
>
> You don’t think they need articles like this? They need anything that will give them a wake-up call... because few ISPs actually go to APNIC, IPv6 Summit, AusNOG, etc and here the message that is being talked about.
>
> And these conversations are working. Just from CeBIT last week I have a dozen leads from ISPs around the country wanting us to look at their infrastructure via our ‘IPv6 Infrastructure Readiness Report’ which we are presently doing all over the APAC region for ISPs, businesses and governments who are slowly waking up.
>
> My point still is... doomsday themed articles can only help... they aren’t going to make people run and hide as that is going to accomplish exactly what the articles are talking about.
>
> ...Skeeve
> --
> Skeeve Stevens, CEO/Technical Director
> eintellego Pty Ltd - The Networking Specialists
> skeeve at eintellego.net / www.eintellego.net
> Phone: 1300 753 383, Fax: (+612) 8572 9954
> Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 / skype://skeeve
> www.linkedin.com/in/skeeve ; facebook.com/eintellego
> --
> NOC, NOC, who's there?
>
> From: ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of Dmitri Kalintsev
> Sent: Monday, 31 May 2010 6:20 AM
> To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] IPv6 Article on CNN
>
> Skeeve,
>
> Agree about the ISPs. I mentioned enterprises because I was (probably naively) thinking that them ISPs don't need CNN articles to get things moving.
>
> Regards,
>
> -- Dmitri
>
> On Sun, May 30, 2010 at 9:57 PM, Skeeve Stevens <Skeeve at eintellego.net> wrote:
> I am not talking about scaring people stiff... I am suggesting more articles detailing just might happen if they don’t start doing something now.
>
> It isn’t too late today... a few months won’t be too late.... one year... yes... problems.
>
> I am not saying ipv4 will be disappearing in a puff of smoke... but this is AusNOG... mostly supposedly to have ISPs and carriers... those who really need to be thinking about IPv6 today... not in 6 months time.
>
> ...Skeeve
>
> --
> Skeeve Stevens, CEO/Technical Director
> eintellego Pty Ltd - The Networking Specialists
> skeeve at eintellego.net / www.eintellego.net
> Phone: 1300 753 383, Fax: (+612) 8572 9954
> Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 / skype://skeeve
> www.linkedin.com/in/skeeve ; facebook.com/eintellego
> --
> NOC, NOC, who's there?
>
> From: ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of Dmitri Kalintsev
> Sent: Sunday, 30 May 2010 6:20 PM
>
> To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] IPv6 Article on CNN
>
> Skeeve,
>
> I feel that a more effective tactic in getting enterprises over the line is not to scare them stiff but to help them with assessing the implications for their particular business.
>
> When people are scared with no obvious way to escape, a reaction is often that of denial. On other hand if they are shown a way to *correctly and effectively* assess the danger *they are in* (which will vary widely, depending on the nature of a particular business - IPv4 isn't exactly going to disappear in a puff of a smoke at the hell's bell's toll), then you will effectively help them to put together a business case to do the necessary movements.
>
> It is all about the money, by the end of the day.
>
> Regards,
>
> -- Dmitri
>
> On Sun, May 30, 2010 at 4:21 PM, Skeeve Stevens <Skeeve at eintellego.net> wrote:
> Kevin,
>
> Last week on our stand at CeBIT I spent a lot of time talking to many people about what we do...and IPv6 came up a lot.
>
> The most frequent comments about IPv6 were:
>
> - What is it?
> - Is there really a need to look at it yet?
> - They didn't have any customers asking for it
> - We will be looking at it soon
> - Not many providers offer it
> - Telstra doesn't offer it - which means it isn't prime-time yet
>
> But the biggest comment was:
>
> - I know what it is, but I haven't heard much about it in the IT media, so we assume it isn't that important yet.
>
> Which is why I now have a stronger opinion that ANY article talking about IPv6 - informational, hype, doomsday-like - are good things. And the more articles, the more 'alarmist' in nature - the better.
>
> Kevin, you'd rather show people the rewards and profits? What profits? Apart from integration and selling people new hardware, there are no real profits in just 'having IPv6'. Rewards? The only reward is being in business in a couple of years time - the most important of all rewards - but you can't sell that.
>
> APNIC, ISOC-AU, IPv6NOW (in this region) and other organisations have taken this softly softly approach for far too long and where is IPv6 adoption at? It is terrible considering how close we are to the ipv4 run-out.
>
> This technology is critical to the Telco/carrier/isp/etc world continuing to operate... those who are responsible to handing out these recourses to the end users have, for the most part minus a few notables (such as Internode, Pipe), have made very little progress in deploying or making this technology widely available to the public/their customers.
>
> Looking into my crystal ball I do see a time a year or so from now where Telstra/Optus/iiNet and Internode will most likely be telling all their customers and the general public about IPv6... at least I hope so. But I am wondering that if that will be soon enough considering the amount of resources required to train all the support staff in the technology.
>
> The only ISP that I know of - Internode - who is doing v6 prime-time, I assume has also internally trained a lot of their support staff. Would Mark/Matthew or someone from Internode let us know where the company is with IPv6 knowledge amongst its front-line staff? (for curiosity and example purposes).
>
> Internode, 'wherever they are' would have to be at the cutting edge of v6 awareness.... I hope. But my worry is that the other BIG ISPs in this country - Telstra, Optus, TPG, iiNET/Netspace, Exetel, Adam and others... how long will it take to get all their staff up to speed.... sales, support (including offshore), netops and so on.... and will it be done in time?
>
> The big thing I hear from ISPs and alike at conferences is that 'no one is asking for it'. Well, if articles that hype the issue of IPv6 up, bring awareness and hopefully cause them to start asking their ISPs, Integrators, local computer stores, and so on... great.... because all the soft talking so far has done very little to help to cause.
>
> The time for softly softly is over. You (larger industry plural) have had your chance.
>
> ...Skeeve
>
>
>
>
> --
> Skeeve Stevens, CEO/Technical Director
> eintellego Pty Ltd - The Networking Specialists
> skeeve at eintellego.net / www.eintellego.net
> Phone: 1300 753 383, Fax: (+612) 8572 9954
> Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 / skype://skeeve
> www.linkedin.com/in/skeeve ; facebook.com/eintellego
> --
> NOC, NOC, who's there?
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net [mailto:ausnog-
> > bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of Kevin Karp
> > Sent: Sunday, 30 May 2010 12:24 PM
> > To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net
> > Subject: [AusNOG] IPv6 Article on CNN
> >
> > Hi Skeeve
> >
> > >Problem is... doomsday articles are sometimes the only way to
> > motivate
> > people.
> >
> > Really?
> > Surely self-interest is a far greater motivator. I don't think that you
> > can use self-preservation as a motivator in this instance (see below).
> > You have to show the rewards that are available that are otherwise
> > unachievable with the current regime.
> >
> > >I believe the impact of Y2K was minimalised due to peoples preparation
> > mostly due to the many
> > > doomsday hype articles.
> >
> > The accompanying exaggeration (and subsequent self-enrichment) is part
> > of the reason why many
> > non-IT industry insiders are justifiably sceptical of doomsday messages
> > from the IT industry.
> >
> > And anyway the doomsday message is just not true.
> >
> > > People are going to need something to move them to IPv6...
> > > and I really don't care how it happens. Scare the crap out of them
> > I say!
> >
> > I'd rather show people the rewards and the profits that are available.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Kevin
> >
> > --
> > STUDENTNET(r) - Highly Commended: Australian Privacy Awards 2008
> > Kevin Karp kjk at studentnet.edu.au
> > next.studentnet.edu.au Tel +61 2 9281 1626
> > Suite 1, 89 Jones St
> > Ultimo NSW 2007 Australia Fax +61 2 9281 3047
> > _____________________________________________________________
> >
> >
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