[AusNOG] What are we , collectively, doing about the impending mandatatory censorship scheme?
Chris Pollock
Chris.Pollock at staff.pipenetworks.com
Thu Jul 8 17:28:45 EST 2010
You've hit the nail right on the head there Kai - we, the Network
Operators of the country, are in literal physical control of the
Internet in Australia. The members of this list build and maintain a
significant portion of the connectivity. Between all of our customers,
and their customers, how many people's network access are we responsible
for?
Ultimately, it is us who will bear the responsibility of the final
choice of whether or not we implement the controls the Government tells
us we have to on our networks. They will have to convince us that we
have to do it. That may be through legislation, fines, legal action or
prosecution, but we will have to be convinced.
"They have the plant, but we have the power."
This is also why I fear the NBN - if they get involved in the tails, we
may not get a choice; it may be filtered before it gets to us, and we
will be powerless to stop them.
--
Chris Pollock
Technical & Install Manager
PIPE Networks Limited
PPC-1 is now live!
6900 km, 20 Months, 2.56 Tbps, 12.5 kilovolts, $200 Million and 100%
Australian Owned.
http://www.pipeinternational.com
Mobile : +61 4 1074 7765
Phone : +61 7 3233 9813
Fax : +61 7 3233 9885
Web : www.pipenetworks.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net
> [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of Kai
> Sent: Thursday, 8 July 2010 5:06 PM
> To: ausnog at ausnog.net
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] What are we , collectively, doing about
> the impending mandatatory censorship scheme?
>
> I don't think a lot of people realise but the idea behind
> that movie is very powerful!
>
> What would it take, and do we have the guts, to do something
> with the same idea and give power back to the people? because
> by the looks of it the government sure as hell aint listening!
>
> When should we start handing out Guy Faulkes masks...?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andrew E" <edo at ohlawd.net>
> To: "Chris Pollock" <Chris.Pollock at staff.pipenetworks.com>
> Cc: "<ausnog at ausnog.net>" <ausnog at ausnog.net>
> Sent: Thursday, 8 July, 2010 4:30:21 PM GMT +09:30 Darwin
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] What are we , collectively, doing about
> the impending mandatatory censorship scheme?
>
>
>
> I was watching V for Vendetta last night. What is fictional
> in that movie is becoming a reality here in aus (monitoring
> all communications, blacklists, etc...)
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 08/07/2010, at 3:26 PM, "Chris Pollock" <
> Chris.Pollock at staff.pipenetworks.com > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
> IMO the the two things are different halves of the same plan,
> as Bevan touched on some weeks ago.
>
> - implement a filtering system which checks every URL entered
> by every Australian
> - implement a data retention system for all ISP's to maintain
> substantial information about user internet and communication history
> - implement a single national broadband network
> - remove AusCERT and establish Government run CERT
>
> So they'd own/run the network, track what you do on it, only
> allow you access to the things they want you to see, and then
> control the threat response. I hope the Telescreen can view
> YouTube videos.
>
> Sounds like a recipe to take control of the Internet to me.
> I'll happily kill the NBN if it means killing the filter. The
> last five houses I've lived in have had over 16mbps down and
> 1meg up, I haven't had a problem with Internet access speed
> since dialup in 2001. And those edge cases that can't get any
> decent speeds aren't even going to be serviced by the NBN
> anyway, USO Corp will be taking the Universal Service
> Obligation customers off Telstra's hands.
>
> You don't have to look at many heat maps to realise that
> getting acceptable broadband speed to the majority of homes
> is NOT the real goal of the NBN. Losing it isn't just
> collateral damage, it's cutting off two heads of the same hydra.
>
>
> --
> Chris Pollock
> Technical & Install Manager
> PIPE Networks Limited
>
>
>
> PPC-1 is now live!
> 6900 km, 20 Months, 2.56 Tbps, 12.5 kilovolts, $200 Million
> and 100% Australian Owned.
> http://www.pipeinternational.com
>
> Mobile : +61 4 1074 7765
> Phone : +61 7 3233 9813
> Fax : +61 7 3233 9885
> Web : www.pipenetworks.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net
> [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of Andrew Oskam
> Sent: Thursday, 8 July 2010 1:49 AM
> To: Skeeve Stevens
> Cc: ausnog at ausnog.net
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] What are we , collectively,doing about
> the impending mandatatory censorship scheme?
>
>
>
> I'm in the same boat as you Skeeve - my thoughts exactly I
> just can't justify the loss of the NBN.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> -------------
> Andrew Oskam
>
> On 08/07/2010, at 12:54 AM, Skeeve Stevens <
> Skeeve at eintellego.net > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Honestly, I am a Labor voter... well... was... not sure now.
>
>
>
> If Abbot hadn't said he was going to scrap the NBN, I would
> be voting for the Liberals... bring back Turnbull... I liked him L
>
>
>
>
> ...Skeeve
>
>
>
> --
>
> Skeeve Stevens, CEO/Technical Director
>
> eintellego Pty Ltd - The Networking Specialists
>
> skeeve at eintellego.net / www.eintellego.net
>
> Phone: 1300 753 383, Fax: (+612) 8572 9954
>
> Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 / skype://skeeve
>
> www.linkedin.com/in/skeeve ; facebook.com/eintellego
>
> --
>
> NOC, NOC, who's there?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From: ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net
> [mailto:ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of Matthew
> Moyle-Croft
> Sent: Thursday, 8 July 2010 12:48 AM
> To: Phillip Grasso
> Cc: Skeeve Stevens; ausnog at ausnog.net
> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] What are we , collectively, doing about
> the impending mandatatory censorship scheme?
>
>
>
> Senate seats might hurt them, but ask yourself this:
>
>
>
>
>
> What do you know about the Opposition's views on the filter?
> If Labor lose will it mean scraping the idea or claiming it
> as their own to claim the same voting block?
>
>
>
>
>
> If the Opposition support it and so do Labor then the
> minorities are irrelevant in the Senate.
>
>
>
>
>
> MMC
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 07/07/2010, at 11:55 PM, Phillip Grasso wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> you raise good points, let me say this;
>
>
>
>
>
> Senate Seats. Hit them where it hurts.
>
>
>
>
>
> my back of envelope count is that we'll need 338K votes to
> get 1 senate seat.
>
>
>
>
>
> 1 Senate seat will probably be enough to do damage to a
> filtering program, especially when they would want to do
> deals to get other things across (assuming they don't have an
> overwhelming majority)
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 12:11 AM, Matthew Moyle-Croft <
> mmc at internode.com.au > wrote:
>
>
>
> On 07/07/2010, at 11:22 PM, Phillip Grasso wrote:
>
> > its been pretty clear what Google position all along. Why
> else do you think Conroy has it in for Google.
> >
> > The problem is that not enough 'outcry' from the industry
> is there, so Conroy is free to say he's got the support of
> the industry, with a possibly few big players in his back
> pocket due to NBN, he can say things such as 'industry
> consultation/support' etc.
>
> I think we could be super organised, with a huge media budget
> and the Fed Govt wouldn't change their mind before the election.
>
> If they did change their mind then the opposition would just
> use it to show (a) they're backing down and not delivering on
> YET another policy (b) not tough on Child Pornography (c) not
> protecting our kids. Which ever of the arguments works the
> best for TonyA at the time.
>
> This isn't a rational argument. It's clear the Conroy isn't
> interested in rational arguments. The whole proposal is
> laughable (heck, I've just come back from the US where we ARE
> a joke because of this - most people think it's already
> running!), but still, the telecommunications industry is a
> poor block of votes compared to keeping the conservative
> Christian lobby on side (the people who want this).
>
> The focus really needs to be on these things:
>
> If Labor is reelected will they claim they have a mandate to
> implement the filter (even if no one voted Labor because of
> it). Or will it die as a "non-core promise" if Conroy is
> moved on as telecommunications minister?
>
> If the Liberals are elected instead, what will they do? Will
> they show sanity and kill it (small-l liberal) or be beholden
> to the same conservative Christian lobby who have convinced
> Labor it's a good idea.
>
> Labor, as above, can't be and won't be able to chance their
> minds before the election. The question is - will this be an
> election issue or will we be back to beating up on the
> vunerable and non-voting refugees again like the tough people
> we are. (Must remind Christians like TonyA about what
> Christianity is about - seem to remember a few bits from the
> Bible from Sunday school and Jesus embracing everyone and
> looking after the poor and destitute, not just some of them -
> anyway, offtopic).
>
> MMC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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