[AusNOG] Is there such thing as peering with Telstra in Australia

[Joseph Goldman]

 > Also, it shows that big hosting companies could choose to penalise 
such ISPs in terms of performance.  That could be an incentive (possibly 
the only one) for them to adopt net neutrality policies.

So they break net neutrality to force net neutrality?

On 03/03/17 19:57, Corrado Fiore wrote:
> Hi Paul, hi All,
>
> to add some perspective on why Telstra and other tier1 operators are restrictive on peering, I suggest these two resources:
>
> http://drpeering.net/white-papers/_presos/WhyTelstraWontPeerv1.0.ppt
>
> https://wiki.hetzner.de/index.php/Double_Paid_Traffic/en
>
> The second link is a mini-essay discussing the situation in Germany.  It is interesting because the dynamics described are very similar to what we're discussing here.  Also, it shows that big hosting companies could choose to penalise such ISPs in terms of performance.  That could be an incentive (possibly the only one) for them to adopt net neutrality policies.
>
> Best,
> Corrado Fiore
>
> ____________________________________________
>> On 3 Mar 2017, at 3:46 PM, Andrew Khoo <Andrew.Khoo at amaysim.com.au> wrote:
>>
>> i guess if there was some economic value for telstra to peer with you settlement-free they would have done it already?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: AusNOG <ausnog-bounces at lists.ausnog.net> on behalf of Alex Samad <alex at samad.com.au>
>> Sent: Friday, March 3, 2017 9:09:50 AM
>> To: Ausnog
>> Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Is there such thing as peering with Telstra in Australia
>>   
>> Has any one thought of challenging that now that there has been a change / enough time has passed ?
>>
>> Alex
>>
>> On 2 March 2017 at 16:14, James Andrewartha <trs80 at ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au> wrote:
>> Hi Paul,
>>
>> On Thu, 2 Mar 2017, Paul Holmanskikh wrote:
>>
>>> Is there any way to peer with Telsta AS1221 within Australia? They are not
>>> present on any IX in Australia. But it seems the only way to peer with Telstra
>>> is to buy transit from them.But transit from Telstra costs absolutely insane
>>> money. I'm looking for peering because Telstra's customers generates good
>>> amount of traffic on our transit links.
>> No. Since you're not a member of the Gang of Four, Telstra has no
>> obligation or desire to peer with you (or anyone else). Some history:
>>
>> http://blog.internode.on.net/2011/05/16/peering-policy-gaps-nbn/
>>
>> "Historically, the ACCC recognised this problem in 1998 and took
>> enforcement action to require peering between IP networks. However, the
>> determination made at the time was fatally flawed. The ACCC decided
>> (incorrectly) at the time that the (then) dominant four players had to
>> peer – but no requirement was placed upon those four to peer with anyone
>> else, ever. All subsequent requests and attempts to peer with Telstra and
>> Optus since then have been rejected by those network providers."
>>
>> See also https://blog.cloudflare.com/bandwidth-costs-around-the-world/
>>
>> --
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