[AusNOG] GoodBye NBN

Sun Sep 8 05:44:38 EST 2013

Same in Dubai

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On 08/09/2013, at 1:44 AM, "Nathan Gardiner" <ngardiner at gmail.com<mailto:ngardiner at gmail.com>> wrote:

There is a mandatory filtering regime in Singapore and from time to time (although you might need to put a bit of effort into looking for something significant or pornographic enough to hit the blacklist) you'll see the dreaded MDA block page pop up.

In practice though, very little in the way of actual censorship is enforced and the blocks are both haphazard (ie, try dropping the www off and you'll get through) or there are workarounds in the form of firefox extensions, tor browsers, etc. Nobody really enforces it thoroughly and again it's really just a bunch of sites of questionable family entertainment value as far as I am aware, it certainly isn't China standard filtering. VPNs here are fine as are pretty much any type of traffic, so you could fill in the blanks on how it might not be an issue for those who really want their nudie sites.

Mind you there is some bona fide (if not draconian) law behind all of this. Pornography is illegal to possess and while they don't block most of what people actually do view, some token sites like playboy are blocked which is a good laugh as I doubt anyone is too devastated.

I understand people's concerns about liberties and could see that there's latitude for it to go in a bad direction but as is it's pretty harmless.

Cheers
Nathan

On Sat, Sep 7, 2013 at 11:22 PM, Colin Stubbs <colin.stubbs at equatetechnologies.com.au<mailto:colin.stubbs at equatetechnologies.com.au>> wrote:

Out of interest, and since it's somewhat topical, what's your experience with the Singaporean filtering/Internet censorship system ?

Colin Stubbs | Equate Technologies
Level 27, Santos Place, 32 Turbot Street, Brisbane, QLD 4000
T: +61 7 3181 5558<tel:%2B61%207%203181%205558> | M: +61 488 000 977<tel:%2B61%20488%20000%20977>
E: colin.stubbs @ equatetechnologies . com . au

On 8 September 2013 00:16, Nathan Gardiner <ngardiner at gmail.com<mailto:ngardiner at gmail.com>> wrote:
Speaking from the experience of having had residential "1Gbps" fibre in Singapore for the last 2+ years on a similar network (the NGBN as they call it or known by the moniker OpenNet) I always feel like I am ruining christmas when I tell people of my experiences with the technology, but here goes anyway.

The network is obviously more financially viable here in Singapore. Just like in Aus, there's been issues with takeup due to landlords not liking the fibre conduits, etc within the premises or just not accepting the deal. Most people are in high-rise so of course there's body corp issues too. Getting it retrofitted later is both expensive and still requires permission which causes all sorts of issues.

Given it's a GPON network you effectively have the 1Gbps fibre strand into an ONT which provides GigE ports, so the oft quoted number of 1Gbps is as true as you'd expect, although very few RSPs provide plans that cover that and for probably very good reason.

Off my ONT I get phone, TV via a STB and Internet. There is noticable slowness in peak hours as compared to offpeak for many although I would say I don't have many complaints in that area. This should be expected with GPON and it's why I'm not really a fan of these speed comparisons that people like to do as they don't quite work that way. There's all sorts of issues we still deal with from RSPs from transparent proxying to traffic shaping, which exists for most RSPs given Singapore, like Australia, is an island with somewhat limited/expensive connectivity to US/Aus/Europe.

Now to the bit I was getting to. Most people I know here are technologists, and most are happy to stick with their ADSL or Cable service. ADSL2+ is fairly prevalent and even where it isn't, people already have cable STB and very few people use home phones so there's little value add there. You pay a premium, not a huge one but a premium nonetheless for fibre plans.
The NGBN was pushed here the same way the large, free wireless system across parts of the island was back 5+ years ago, by the IDA (Infocomm Development Authority) as a major breakthrough in providing access to all sorts of new technologies and ways of doing business across the island. Consider that Singapore has a proportionally high level of technology aware citizens, a national broadband network, and a high rate of phone app developers etc etc which could benefit from this.

Years later - zip, zilch, nada. If there was you'd know about it and you'd know why you wanted this technology so bad. Yes the ubiquity of connectivity is great but fibre isn't really going to the most remote places so that can't be the point. Yes I get fast internet, no cap, reasonable shaping but on a volume level I could achieve anything I do today on ADSL2+. For the STB, there's HFC cable. Pay TV is expensive enough that I don't use it, anyway.

This rant could go on but I'll cut it short just to say that I don't see the value of this technology being particularly in line with the cost of the deployment, and can't see why the phased deployment couldn't be structured to replace the actual ageing infra and not rip up the whole lot. Perhaps I'm missing the point and perhaps these great new technologies will eventually emerge - but perhaps they won't, like the IDA's wireless deployment which is useful now only to tourists as everyone else has more flexible 4G LTE (or whatever the interim standard is).

TL;DR - it's a lot of money for the same interwebs and the novelty wears off pretty quick

Cheers
Nathan

On Sat, Sep 7, 2013 at 8:33 PM, Paul Wallace <paul.wallace at mtgi.com.au<mailto:paul.wallace at mtgi.com.au>> wrote:
Do you really believe that fibre offers a silver bullet, zero down-time, crackle free, drop out free, 100% perfect outcome?

Where on Earth does this preposterous suggestion come from?

The undisputed truth of the matter is that the (copper based) PSTN network in Australia has been super reliable for decades. Personally I'm in my 50's and cannot remember (possibly due to age) the last time my dial tone failed!

By contrast my VoIP service crackles, fails in all manner if ways, never actually rings but sounds liked it's ringing and otherwise offers no competition if the test is going to be based solely on 'availability'.

So could you PLEASE help my old Mum understand why she needs a tradie to attend her home to pull cables, then figure out which VoIP handset to buy, then which RSP to choose, then accept that it has wrinkles that's she's never previously conceived ... just because the ALP continues to assert that it's imperative that we spend billions on getting rid of something my old Mum is 100% happy with!!

HFC is perfectly suitable for script kids to download their stuff and if it only occurs at 40Mbs and not at 41Mb (due to coming to them from the USA ((despite their GigE NBN connection)) then they should just wait the extra few seconds.

These same kids invented 'butt chugging' because they couldn't even stand waiting the few minutes it takes to get drunk outa their minds on a Sat night .. and now they're controlling politics!

All this from a crowd that cannot even BEGIN to focus on the real issues such as solving the problem that ZERO tourists can land via aircraft in Sydney for 17% of every single day of every single week! Instead they're going to spend all of our money on moving the Navy from Garden Island to QLD.

Gimme a break!

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On 07/09/2013, at 9:48 PM, "wingar at team-metro.net<mailto:wingar at team-metro.net>" <wingar at team-metro.net<mailto:wingar at team-metro.net>> wrote:

It’s not just WA that gets it. Anywhere even semi-rural get’s it.

~Em

From: Jacob Bisby
Sent: Saturday, 7 September 2013 9:46 PM
To: ausnog at lists.ausnog.net<mailto:ausnog at lists.ausnog.net>

Nevermind the internet access, fibre would have solved the primitive
land-line phone call quality problems that plague my area and it's
surrounds in WA.

- Jacob

On 7/09/2013 7:39 PM, Tim March wrote:
> You won't need to worry about connecting to the NBN if you can't suss
> out how to correctly configure your CPE anyway =)
>
>
>
> T.
>
> On 7/09/13 9:37 PM, Daniel Watson wrote:
>> Well its offical
>>
>> For those of you who are not watching (Not that i am, i glanced over)
>>
>> Rudd 49,  Abbott 79
>>
>> I think its time to buy my airline ticket out of here...
>>
>>
>> D.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> AusNOG mailing list
>> AusNOG at lists.ausnog.net<mailto:AusNOG at lists.ausnog.net>
>> http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog
>>

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