<div dir="ltr">Awesome reply Mark! </div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Sat, 15 Dec 2018 at 11:59, Mark Newton <<a href="mailto:newton@atdot.dotat.org">newton@atdot.dotat.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
    Halon was banned at the same time as CFCs in aerosols and
    refrigerants because it's an Ozone depleting gas. There should not
    be any Halon datacentres anywhere in Australia. Probably not
    anywhere in the world, tbqh.<br>
    <br>
    Aviation is an exempt use, which is why you saw it on your C-17. You
    can buy fixed or portable halon systems intended for deployment in
    aircraft even today (for example:
<a class="gmail-m_-6443472150577915566moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/pspages/h3rhalon.php?clickkey=11303" target="_blank">https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/pspages/h3rhalon.php?clickkey=11303</a>
    -- one of the few few ways you can acquire ozone depleting gasses as
    a retail customer in 2018!)<br>
    <br>
    CO2 is a hazardous gas, and should be pretty rare for fire
    suppression. Possible that there are still some small and/or ancient
    systems out there, but risk assessment under OHS&W legislation
    ought to have seen them all replaced by now.<br>
    <br>
    Datacentres in Australia will be using FM-200 or Inergen. FM-200 can
    be stored in compressed gas or liquid; obviously liquid means the
    storage takes up significantly less volume. FM-200 has fallen out of
    favor during the last five years because it's a greenhouse gas,
    which makes me regret not having a crystal ball when I was putting
    it in datacentres ten years ago :-)<br>
    <br>
    Both of them are engineered solutions which take the room volume
    into account. The goal is to add enough gas to the room to drop the
    oxygen content from 19% to something in the 15%-17% range, which is
    low enough to extinguish most fire but high enough to sustain human
    life. If you're in the room when it goes off you'll end up
    uncomfortably short of breath (and probably very cold!), but you
    shouldn't suffocate if the system has been designed properly.<br>
    <br>
    A complete system will generally also include a pre-action dry pipe
    deluge sprinkler system which can trigger if the gas fails to
    extinguish the fire.<br>
    <br>
    ... and a good insurance policy. If any of these systems go off,
    might end up with system loss and/or data loss. Hard disks don't
    like rapid pressure changes or large quantities of water, so all
    bets are off once the VESDA trips out.<br>
    <br>
      - mark<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="gmail-m_-6443472150577915566moz-cite-prefix">On 12/13/2018 01:13 PM, Nathan Sullivan
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      
      <div dir="ltr">I remember walking onboard a C-17 Globemaster a
        year or two ago at Amberley, still had Halon installed with
        proper masks sitting next to the buttons. Probably one of those
        "exempt" / "critical" use cases I'm sure being military...</div>
      <br>
      <div class="gmail_quote">
        <div dir="ltr">On Thu, Dec 13, 2018 at 12:10 PM Adam Gibson <<a href="mailto:a.gibson@springfieldcitygroup.com" target="_blank">a.gibson@springfieldcitygroup.com</a>>
          wrote:<br>
        </div>
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
          <div lang="EN-AU">
            <div class="gmail-m_-6443472150577915566m_-2862569899821323613WordSection1">
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span>FM200 is still used in a few
                  DC’s in Sydney and Brisbane to my knowledge. But is
                  costly to replace due to environmental charges.
                </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span>In Polaris we check all our
                  bottles in accordance to the fire program (which was
                  approved upon completion with the fire code of that
                  time) which is every year, bottles are check and every
                  month, fire tech comes out to inspect gauges release
                  valves and all control boards. All bottles are to be
                  replaced every 10 years of less and  Co2 bottles to
                  replaced every 3 years.
                </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span>In my opinion, fire is
                  something that is neglected a lot in DC’s.</span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span>AG</span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black">Adam
                  Gibson</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black">Head
                    of Data Centres</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black"></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Springfield
                  City Group </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif;color:black"> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black">t:
                  +61 7 3819 9999</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif;color:black"></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black">f:
                  +61 7 3819 9900</span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black">m:
                  +61 4 00 807 822</span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black">e:</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><a href="mailto:a.gibson@springfieldcitygroup.com" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(5,99,193)">mailto:a.gibson@springfieldcitygroup.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(51,51,255)"> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> AusNOG <<a href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>>
                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Bruce Forster<br>
                  <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, 13 December 2018 10:36 AM<br>
                  <b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:chris.ford@inaboxgroup.com.au" target="_blank">chris.ford@inaboxgroup.com.au</a><br>
                  <b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>
                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] [AUSNog] : Re Data Centre
                  Fire Suppression Safety</span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
              <div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">Pretty sure halon is banned, but
                    fm200 is the gas used these days?</p>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://www.safelife.az/en/index.php/services/firefighting-by-gas.html" target="_blank">https://www.safelife.az/en/index.php/services/firefighting-by-gas.html</a></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(102,102,102)">Firstly,
                        the most important advantage of the use of
                        chemical gas - it is safe for people and
                        electronic equipment. During fire fighting gas
                        is used in a concentration not to be harmful to
                        human health and life. When using the FM200 gas
                        concentration of oxygen in the room is reduced
                        by 3%. Along with the fact that such a
                        composition of the air is not sufficient to
                        continue the fire, it allows people who are
                        there to breathe.</span></p>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </div>
              <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
              <div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">On Thu, Dec 13, 2018 at 10:01 AM
                    Chris Ford <<a href="mailto:chris.ford@inaboxgroup.com.au" target="_blank">chris.ford@inaboxgroup.com.au</a>>
                    wrote:</p>
                </div>
                <blockquote style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin:5pt 0cm 5pt 4.8pt">
                  <div>
                    <div>
                      <p class="MsoNormal">As a university cadet working
                        for IBM in the late 80s I remember getting
                        inducted into the Westpac data centres and
                        getting a long explanation of what to do when
                        the halon system went off – where the breathing
                        gear was, where the exits were, to basically
                        just drop everything and run.</p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal">Have been inducted into a few
                        DCs in the last 3 years and can’t remember that
                        being part of the induction at all – although
                        given I already knew it I may have just glossed
                        over that part.</p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><span>--</span></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:115%">
                        <span>Chris
                          Ford</span></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:115%">
                        <span>Chief
                          Technology Officer</span></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:115%">
                        <span> </span></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>INABOX
                            GROUP</span></b></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:115%">
                        <b><span>m</span></b><b><span>
                          </span></b><span>0401
                          988 844
                        </span><b><span>e</span></b><b><span>
                          </span></b><a href="mailto:chris.ford@inaboxgroup.com.au" target="_blank"><span>chris.ford@inaboxgroup.com.au</span></a></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span>t</span></b><b><span>
                          </span></b><span>02 8275
                          6871
                        </span><b><span>w</span></b><b><span>
                          </span></b><a href="http://www.inaboxgroup.com.au" target="_blank"><span>www.inaboxgroup.com.au</span></a></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36pt">
                        <b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> AusNOG <</span><a href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</span></a><span lang="EN-US">>
                          <b>On Behalf Of </b>Paul Wilkins<br>
                          <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, 13 December 2018 10:53
                          AM<br>
                          <b>To:</b> </span><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</span></a><span lang="EN-US"><br>
                          <b>Subject:</b> [AusNOG] [AUSNog] : Re Data
                          Centre Fire Suppression Safety</span></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36pt">
                         </p>
                      <div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:36pt">
                            Every data centre has a fire suppression
                            system. We're not used to thinking of this
                            as a hazardous environment, but consequent
                            to
                            <a href="https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/dec/12/antarctica-two-technicians-dead-mcmurdo-station-ross-island" target="_blank">
                              two techs being found dead working on a
                              fire suppression system in Antarctica</a>,
                            I find myself wondering yet again, why there
                            aren't more stringent controls around the
                            fire suppression systems in data centres:
                            viz - when you enter a data centre, how
                            confident can you be you're not going to be
                            quietly asphyxiated?<br>
                            <br>
                            Kind regards<br>
                            <br>
                            Paul Wilkins</p>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
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                </blockquote>
              </div>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all">
              </p>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
              </div>
              <p class="MsoNormal">-- </p>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">Regards,<br>
                  <br>
                  Bruce</p>
              </div>
            </div>
          </div>
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