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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">I had a fairly long session in front of
      the PJCIS hearing on Friday afternoon. The audio stream isn't up
      on APH yet, but theres been a few articles in the IT media.<br>
      <br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.zdnet.com/article/no-need-to-keep-encryption-busting-capabilities-secret-internet-australia/">https://www.zdnet.com/article/no-need-to-keep-encryption-busting-capabilities-secret-internet-australia/</a><br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.itwire.com/government-tech-policy/85302-encryption-bill-problems-due-to-secret-drafting,-says-ia.html">https://www.itwire.com/government-tech-policy/85302-encryption-bill-problems-due-to-secret-drafting,-says-ia.html</a><br>
      <br>
      There are two more hearings, both in Canberra scheduled 27th and
      30th November. They should be livestreamed with video, while this
      Sydney hearing was only audio.<br>
      <br>
      There are more submissions rolling in and being published almost
      daily, despite the formal submissions period being 'closed'. If
      you'd like to tell the PJCIS what you think, they will still
      accept and publish submissions -
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/Joint/Intelligence_and_Security/TelcoAmendmentBill2018/Submissions">https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/Joint/Intelligence_and_Security/TelcoAmendmentBill2018/Submissions</a><br>
      <br>
      One of the latest (#85) is from Senatas, an Australian
      manufacturer and vendor of network encryption security devices,
      warning of economic damage to Australia's IT export industry.<br>
      <br>
      Paul (wearing hat as Chair, Internet Australia)<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      On 18/11/2018 11:45 AM, Paul Wilkins wrote:<br>
    </div>
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cite="mid:CAMmROTK1+vT4DShO6VVi3b9TC3UEg1onrbByZ3JF42TopQAGjw@mail.gmail.com">
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          <div>This list was intended to highlight salient concerns, and
            not as a summary of the areas of real concern. A more
            complete summary of concerns would look more like:</div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>
            <div>1 - Why is there no judicial oversite of these sweeping
              police powers?</div>
            <div>2 - Scope of powers go beyond terrorism and serious
              crime when it's not supposed to.<br>
            </div>
            <div>3 - It supports the establishment of the machinery of
              mass surveillance when it's not supposed to.<br>
            </div>
            <div>4 - It weakens the Internet's security, when it's not
              supposed to.</div>
            <div>5 - Why are there no limits to ensure issue of
              TCNs/TANs/TARs are necessary and proportionate to the
              human right to privacy, unrevokeable per the Declaration
              of Human Rights.</div>
            <div>6 - Why the deliberate exclusion/incompatibility of the
              provisions of the Privacy Act 1988?<br>
            </div>
            <div>7 - Why are there no limits to ensure issue of
              TCNs/TANs/TARs are necessary and proportionate to service
              providers rights private property, unrevokeable per the
              Declaration of Human Rights.</div>
          </div>
          <div>
            <div>8 - When Police Powers lie with the States, what
              constitutional head of power supports the Bill's  scope,
              without enabling legislation from the States conferring
              power? The Constitution confers national security powers,
              but the scope of the Bill's police powers exceeds this
              remit.<br>
              9 - Why has the Bill overlooked the obvious alternative of
              powers spread across a dozen Law Enforcement Agencies,
              which is to centralise in one single agency, providing for
              greater data security, governance, efficiency, and
              accountability.<br>
              10 - Why the lack of provisions for accountability for the
              exercise of police powers, and checks and balances
              commensurate to the reach of sweeping police powers, quite
              incompatible with the democratic institutions and
              traditions of Liberal Democracy?<br>
              11 - Why the deliberately curtailed public consultation
              process and attempt to ambush both the public and
              government with this Bill by Dep't Home Affairs, and
              representations of public and industry consultations as
              being timely and adequate, incompatible with the facts on
              the public record and the express concerns of the public,
              human rights groups, and industry?<br>
              12 - Why the absence of recompense for injury to
              reputation or to service providers' business, or other
              injury consequent to police malfeasance or misfeasance?
              The Bill's protections are not comprehensive, and where
              they make provision, go only as far as to establish lack
              of liability for unlawful disclosures.<br>
              13 - Why has the government of the day referred this
              deeply flawed Bill to the PJCIS, PJCHR, and the SSCSB, for
              review wasting public time and money, rather than sending
              it back to Dep't Home Affairs for a complete overhaul of
              it's scope and objectives?<br>
            </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Kind regards</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Paul Wilkins</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>
              <div class="gmail_quote">
                <div dir="ltr">On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 at 13:10, Paul
                  Wilkins <<a href="mailto:paulwilkins369@gmail.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">paulwilkins369@gmail.com</a>>
                  wrote:<br>
                </div>
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                    <div>These are all good points.</div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Home Affairs put up this Bill on the premise
                      it's needed to fight terrorism and serious crime
                      in the context of increasing use of encryption.
                      Unfortunately, this isn't that bill.<br>
                    </div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Home Affairs seem rather uninterested in
                      explaining why the remit of this Bill goes well
                      beyond this:</div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>1 - Why is there no judicial oversite of these
                      sweeping police powers?</div>
                    <div>2 - Scope of powers go beyond terrorism and
                      serious crime when it's not supposed to.<br>
                    </div>
                    <div>3 - It supports the establishment of the
                      machinery of mass surveillance when it's not
                      supposed to.<br>
                    </div>
                    <div>4 - It weakens the Internet's security, when
                      it's not supposed to.</div>
                    <div>5 - Why are there no limits to ensure issue of
                      TCNs/TANs/TARs are necessary and proportionate to
                      the human right to privacy, unrevokeable per the
                      Declaration of Human Rights.<br>
                    </div>
                    <div>6 - Why are there no limits to ensure issue of
                      TCNs/TANs/TARs are necessary and proportionate to
                      service providers rights private property,
                      unrevokeable per the Declaration of Human Rights.</div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Unfortunately the way the Bill's drafted, the
                      only limit on the use of the Bill's powers is the
                      Dep't Home Affairs.</div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>There's also the very interesting
                      constitutional question, how, when Police Powers
                      lie with the States, what constitutional head of
                      power supports the Bill's scope, without enabling
                      legislation from the States conferring power.<br>
                    </div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Kind regards</div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Paul Wilkins<br>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <br>
                  <div class="gmail_quote">
                    <div dir="ltr">On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 at 10:34, Scott
                      Weeks <<a href="mailto:surfer@mauigateway.com"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">surfer@mauigateway.com</a>>
                      wrote:<br>
                    </div>
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                      <br>
                      It's still Friday here, so I am looking like I'm
                      working <br>
                      while reading these posts as I only have an hour
                      and a <br>
                      half to go before happy hour starts...  ;-)<br>
                      <br>
                      <br>
                      --- <a
                        href="mailto:christian.heinrich@cmlh.id.au"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">christian.heinrich@cmlh.id.au</a>
                      wrote:<br>
                      From: Christian Heinrich <<a
                        href="mailto:christian.heinrich@cmlh.id.au"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">christian.heinrich@cmlh.id.au</a>><br>
                      <br>
                      Also <br>
                      <a
href="https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/are-encrypted-phones-allowing-criminals-to-get-away-with-murder-20150523-gh82gv.html"
                        rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"
                        moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/are-encrypted-phones-allowing-criminals-to-get-away-with-murder-20150523-gh82gv.html</a><br>
                      which was 55 devices and 800 clients.<br>
                      <br>
                      Therefore the TAC et al are overkill within the
                      context of the<br>
                      Australian population of 25,000,000+<br>
                      ------------------------------------------------<br>
                      <br>
                      This is a joke.  Right?  <br>
                      <br>
                      "...with the devices being used to arrange at
                      least two recent <br>
                      murders and hampered investigations into at least
                      two others."<br>
                      <br>
                      "Phantom Secure...enables messages to be sent and
                      ledgers kept <br>
                      on a device which investigators cannot crack or
                      intercept."<br>
                      <br>
                      "...we are confident we can erode their impact."<br>
                      <br>
                      So if the criminals used postal mail to arrange
                      those crimes<br>
                      and sent ledgers in the postal mail, would they
                      say 'we have <br>
                      to be able to read every postal mail' to erode
                      their impact <br>
                      and ensure safety and national security???  And, 4
                      crimes <br>
                      happened on a cell phone that's encrypted, so we
                      need to be <br>
                      able to read the contents of 25 million+ cell
                      phones whenever <br>
                      we want.  Just in case.  <br>
                      <br>
                      <br>
                      "...representatives from the NSW Police have
                      travelled to <br>
                      BlackBerry's headquarters in Canada in a bid to
                      get advice <br>
                      on how to retrieve information from the encrypted
                      devices."<br>
                      <br>
                      Wow, a free trip to Canada because they can't do
                      phone calls <br>
                      of internet video conferencing?  Something stinks!<br>
                      <br>
                      <br>
                      ======================================<br>
                      <br>
                      <br>
                      <a
href="http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-04/queensland-fraud-squad-raised-$800k-three-years-project-synergy/8858852"
                        rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"
                        moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-04/queensland-fraud-squad-raised-$800k-three-years-project-synergy/8858852</a><br>
                      <br>
                      "Earlier this year the ABC lodged a right to
                      information <br>
                      application for documents outlining how much money
                      had <br>
                      been raised by Project Synergy.<br>
                      <br>
                      It was refused by Queensland Police."<br>
                      <br>
                      "The QPS has told the ABC that money raised was
                      used for <br>
                      training, cyber-safety programs and fraud
                      awareness."<br>
                      <br>
                      BWAHAHAHAHA!  No we're not going to tell you how
                      we spent <br>
                      tons of money we shouldn't have spent.  (Maybe for
                      fun on <br>
                      the Canada trip?)<br>
                      <br>
                      "...including some questionable items such as wine
                      <br>
                      coolers for a children's program".<br>
                      <br>
                      Further, we're going to get the kids drunk, so
                      they won't <br>
                      either.<br>
                      <br>
                      >:-)   <= evil grin<br>
                      <br>
                      scott<br>
                      <br>
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                      <br>
                      _______________________________________________<br>
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