<div dir="ltr"><div><div>Time was you might have asked for and got your 5 minute argument and left a satisfied customer. That was a generation ago and it dates Python. These days, the Marketing team's letting the side down if you haven't been offered your complimentary definitional wrangle, upsold to a value added tirade with the bundled ad hominem, which then seamlessly segues into a Power Point slide deck of our exciting line of packages - the feud, dispute, or jeremiad.<br><br></div>Kind regards<br><br></div>Paul Wilkins<br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 28 September 2016 at 12:51, Jim Woodward <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jim@alwaysnever.net" target="_blank">jim@alwaysnever.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">+1 with everyone else that would like a stop thread on this, it's starting to overlap the same subject matter and really needs it's own mailing list or forum as I only have paid for the five minute argument and I think we've got our full five minutes worth :) </montypython><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
Jim.</font></span><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
On 28/09/2016 10:43 AM, Nathanael Bettridge wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Hi Skeeve,<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: AusNOG [mailto:<a href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">ausnog-bounces@lists.a<wbr>usnog.net</a>] On Behalf Of<br>
Skeeve Stevens<br>
<br>
A lot of people have this idea that everything should be openly discussed<br>
because doing it helps us all understand the situation and we can all<br>
contribute and solve the problem. This is a stupid idea mostly perpetrated by<br>
people who is not the person actually at most risk or the most to lose.<br>
</blockquote>
As others have mentioned, the obscurity vs public discussion matter is at the very least debatable if not entirely debunked. It's still a natural tendency though for people to want to conceal "dangerous" information.<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Should we openly discuss, on an archived list, with press watching. how we<br>
could use household goods to make explosives?<br>
Or talk about how easy it is to make certain bioweapons and the different<br>
ways we could deploy them?<br>
</blockquote>
No, because they would be off-topic :)<br>
It's also possibly illegal to give too much detail on that in Australia, though it probably shouldn't be if it is.<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Or should we perhaps talk about how easy it is to commit fraud?<br>
</blockquote>
It's come up in other lists and here from memory a few times.<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Yes... lets give blueprints to people who are motived by malice so that they<br>
can go off and do what we're suggesting puts us at risk.<br>
</blockquote>
If people want to do bad things they'll do it regardless. It's not hard to figure out. At least we can be aware of the possibilities for defensive planning.<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Suitable forums are private industry ones with a membership criteria which is<br>
often gated to certain professions, peer recommendations, and so on.<br>
</blockquote>
You are welcome to restrict your own participation in these kinds of discussions to those forums of course.<br>
Others can make their own decisions on that.<br>
<br>
-Nathanael Bettridge<br>
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</blockquote>
<br>
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