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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 17/09/2015 7:56 AM, Skeeve Stevens
wrote:<br>
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cite="mid:CANs0DvsCELDcA0-P1V50orGpUhOLSNyVYqESdfB3AY4z2ZWdhA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">I am saying that while the CVC should be like
$2.... if they aggregated their PoI's, you'd need a lot less
because it would scale much much more and it would actually
costs less.</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Methinks you're confusing topology with charging model. If you
negotiated your wholesale backhaul provider to just add up all the
traffic on all the POI ports and charge you for the aggregate,
rather than per physical port, it wouldn't matter how many actual
POIs there were.<br>
<br>
This whole mess also seems to hang on two assumptions:<br>
1) every ISP needs to service the whole national footprint<br>
2) every ISP needs to charge the same uniform retail price all over
the footprint.<br>
<br>
Are either of these true?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANs0DvsCELDcA0-P1V50orGpUhOLSNyVYqESdfB3AY4z2ZWdhA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
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...Skeeve</p>
<p
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--</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-size:13px;font-family:Calibri;color:rgb(32,73,125)">Skeeve
Stevens - <span
style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">The
ISP Guy - Internet Provider SME</span></p>
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<div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 11:15 PM, Mark
Smith <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:markzzzsmith@gmail.com" target="_blank">markzzzsmith@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
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<p dir="ltr"><br>
On 16 Sep 2015 21:51, "Skeeve Stevens" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:skeeve%2Bausnog@theispguy.com"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:skeeve+ausnog@theispguy.com">skeeve+ausnog@theispguy.com</a></a>>
wrote:<br>
><br>
> Why do that NBNCo?... just go back to the original
PoI design and make it easier/cheaper rather than 7000
poi's... THAT is why it is expensive for the smaller
guys.... shebus.<br>
></p>
<p dir="ltr">So you think NBNco's CVC and AVC charges are
cheap?</p>
<p dir="ltr">How is carrying data on their network to one of
14 POIs going to be cheaper that hot potatoing it out one
of 121 POIs where *you* then get to choose the POI
interconnect/wholesale provider, who may also provide a
cheaper POI aggregation service so you don't have to
literally connect to 121 POIs if you don't want to.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Again, why *must* you directly connect to a
POI, making you think that 14 POIs is better than 121?</p>
<p dir="ltr">In other words, you want to be a wholesale
lever customer, but want the government/NBNco to wear the
wholesale capital costs? They're not going to do that
unless they get a commercial return for doing so. In other
words, you're going to pay, one way or another, because
TINSTAAFL.</p>
<p dir="ltr">So if cost of POI connection is the only
important criteria, then clearly 14 is also way, way too
many. Who wants to have 14 routers/switches when you could
have one? Isn't the ideal number of POIs, cost wise, 1 POI
for the whole of Australia? </p>
<p dir="ltr">Actually cost wise, theoretically it would be
better for the government to do everything - they can
theoretically get scales of economy that no private
company can get and they can borrow at better rates than
any private company can because they're borrowing against
the country.</p>
<p dir="ltr">So perhaps the ideal number of POIs is 0.</p>
<p dir="ltr">> C'mon... who is advising these guys... do
we have a new decent Comms Minister we can appear for
sanity to?<br>
><br>
><br>
> ...Skeeve<br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
><br>
> Skeeve Stevens - The ISP Guy - Internet Provider SME<br>
><br>
> Email: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:skeeve@theispguy.com" target="_blank">skeeve@theispguy.com</a> ; Cell:
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%2B61%280%29414%20753%20383"
value="+61414753383" target="_blank">+61(0)414 753 383</a><br>
><br>
> Skype: skeeve; Blog: TheISPGuy.com ;
Facebook: TheISPGuy<br>
><br>
> Linkedin: /in/skeeve ; Expert360: Profile<br>
><br>
><br>
> On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 7:20 PM, <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:ausftth@mail.com"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ausftth@mail.com">ausftth@mail.com</a></a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> Not content with their monopoly position and the
mess they made so far, the NBNco now wants to compete for
POI backhaul with it's own customers too.<br>
>><br>
>> "In a speech to the National Press Club today,
Morrow said around 40 of the NBN's national 121 points of
interconnect (PoI) are currently too expensive for smaller
ISPs to reach.<br>
>><br>
>> Morrow has accepted the NBN could have to play a
role in forcing the hand of the market, or stepping up if
it turns out no one else is willing to go to some
locations."<br>
>><br>
>> Now, I'm all for lower backhaul costs, but surely
there would have been better ways to go about this than
this sudden change of heart. It's like some bloke at the
NBNco found an Econ 101 textbook, happened upon the
definition of regulatory uncertainty and came up with the
brilliant idea of field testing the concept.<br>
>><br>
>> Source: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.itnews.com.au/news/nbn-wants-to-cut-access-costs-for-smaller-isps-409244"
target="_blank">http://www.itnews.com.au/news/nbn-wants-to-cut-access-costs-for-smaller-isps-409244</a><br>
>><br>
>> Jared<br>
>><br>
>><br>
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