<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
But if a ISP isn't logging other services, and the other services
are non-local, or are excluded from the legislation, then what is
the point?<br>
<br>
E.g. Say someone makes a bomb making forum, hosts it on some cheap
$5/month aussie hosting, then ASIO gets none of that.<br>
Or someone puts a bomb making IRC channel on a cheap Australian VPS.<br>
Completely ignoring that you could do this offshore of course.<br>
<br>
So did they just design this legislation to catch the dumbest of the
dumbest organised criminals?<br>
Cause it sure won't catch anyone else.<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 02/03/15 10:17, Paul Brooks wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:54F39DF4.2010604@layer10.com.au" type="cite">
<meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/03/2015 9:36 AM, Mark McKibbin
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAG0JPfxTFr7XrjKBFud4utrr+-2KFAr2WAY21t7fkP8qwM2oQw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Not sure how this would work (from the report)
<div><br>
</div>
<div>(a) the type of communication; Examples: Voice, SMS,
email, chat, forum, social media. (b) the type of the
relevant service; Examples: ADSL, Wi-Fi, VoIP, cable, GPRS,
VoLTE, LTE. (c) the features of the relevant service that
were, or would have been, used by or enabled for the
communication. Examples: call waiting, call forwarding,
bandwidth allowances<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Surely the ISP cannot record Chat, Forum, Social Media
(there is a comma between Chat and Forum) this would have to
be up to the Facebooks, Googles etc?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
Near as we can figure out (and IANAL, and this is not legal
advice, consult your own legal professional) you are correct- you
only need to store data about services you actually provide, not
services that pass through you that are provided by someone else.
If you provide email service, you need to collect your email logs.
If your customers use Gmail etc or any external email source -
you don't need to detect or store data about that. If you provide
a webmail interface into your own email service - you'll probably
need to collect records for email interactions through that
interface.<br>
<br>
You would need to collect chat or forum records if you provided
the chat or forum service/facility yourself - not for an external
chat service. If you run your own forum, presumably you have the
mappings between the forum userids and your customer details, or
at least login records that map a userid login with the origin IP
address. Or perhaps you don't have those mappings, and the
authority would have to provide you a forum userid to report on,
separate from a IP address/date/timestamp to report on.<br>
<br>
If you were an ISP and only provided Internet access and no other
value added functions, you might only have to report 'Type of
Comms: Internet Access, Type of Service: ADSL2+' along with
allocated IP address and date/time records for example (and
apparently their plan details, things like whether Annex M was
enabled, etc.). Over time, that might be a bigger mix of 'Type of
Comms: Internet Access, Type of Service: FTTx' for various values
of 'x'.<br>
<br>
However, this is all up for discussion between you and the CAC and
your Data Retention Implementation Plans.<br>
See <b>187E Applying for approval of data retention
implementation plans</b>.<br>
I can see a huge backlog in the CAC department over the next few
years as 400+ ISPs attempt to get between 1 - 10+ DRIPs approved
each.<br>
<br>
P.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAG0JPfxTFr7XrjKBFud4utrr+-2KFAr2WAY21t7fkP8qwM2oQw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 2 March 2015 at 09:20, Stuart Low
<span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stuart.low@me.com" target="_blank">stuart.low@me.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto">
<div>Hmm, ok so a little bit off topic but 2 years, is
that all that's required? Lucky you guys! In finance
it's 7 years for typical and infinite for specific
elements (trader convos). For even a small
organisations that translates to 10+ PB and it's
expensive and often tediously look after (hello from
the trenches :p).</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>RE: Glacier, realise that Amazon provides no
guarantee it will be available (ie. Best effort) which
depending on your risk appetite might not be good
enough. I believe Hitachi has been offering a private
label setup based on HCP for a while, probably an
order of magnitude more expensive though.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Never thought I'd say this but dual spool tape
onsite/offsite may be cheaper...</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Stu</div>
<div>
<div class="h5">
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
On 2 Mar 2015, at 9:06 am, Damien Gardner Jnr <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rendrag@rendrag.net"
target="_blank">rendrag@rendrag.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Is that all it's going to be? If
that's the case, I'm set, as I already archive
90% of my mailserver logs for 2 years as a
requirement of one of my customers (funnily
enough, AGD :-p)<br>
<br>
We were just discussing it at $dayjob, and the
Network team were of the understanding it
would require us archiving our sflow data (or
is that no longer on the table?? If so, that
makes it a lot easier!). I did some quick
sums, and shoving that into Amazon Glacier
(80TB/month growth) would be growing at
$800/month^2 - so once you hit the 2 years
retention requirement, you're holding at 1.9PB
of storage (!@#!#!), and paying $19k/month for
that storage. And that's at 100:1 sflow
sampling (full netflow would NOT be possible)
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 2 March 2015 at
09:00, Mark McKibbin <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mark@team.dcsi.net.au"
target="_blank">mark@team.dcsi.net.au</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">I don't agree with the
legislation, however as we are now stuck
with it it does not seem over onerous.
At a glance it looks like encrypted mail
logs (no big deal), telephone call data
that we already record.... have I missed
something?
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Cheers</div>
<div>Mark McKibbin</div>
<div>DCSI</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">
<div>
<div><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 2 March
2015 at 08:47, Nathan Brookfield <span
dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Nathan.Brookfield@simtronic.com.au"
target="_blank">Nathan.Brookfield@simtronic.com.au</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div link="blue" vlink="purple"
lang="EN-AU">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I
know it covers me
without any hesitation
unfortunately so I’ve
come to grips with the
fact I just need to suck
it up. Storage is
cheap, mirror ports are
easy to implement and
we’re small enough at
the moment that it’s not
going to cause me any
major pain and we’ll
likely never be asked
for the data… </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US"> Damien
Gardner Jnr [mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rendrag@rendrag.net" target="_blank">rendrag@rendrag.net</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, 2
March 2015 8:43 AM</span></p>
<div>
<div><br>
<b>To:</b> Nathan
Brookfield<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Paul Wilkins;
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re:
[AusNOG] Welcome to
Metadata Retention</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sorry,
but I just don't
agree. The way I
read it as it
currently stands, I
can basically ignore
the legislation
until someone
definitively says I
have to (i.e. the
'The minister may
issue a
determination
specifically
declaring a company
to be a hosting
provider').</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It
sounds like you
WANT to have to
collect metadata
Nath ;) Why are
you arguing so
hard to be covered
by the new
legislation??</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On
2 March 2015 at
08:38, Nathan
Brookfield <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:Nathan.Brookfield@simtronic.com.au"
target="_blank">Nathan.Brookfield@simtronic.com.au</a>>
wrote:</p>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">In
the best case
scenario they
are leasing
the ‘Hardware’
but that does
not mean they
are leasing
the space, in
the majority
of cases they
are going to
be paying for
a ‘service’
which you are
providing on
your own
hardware
(hosting/vps)
and you ‘the
hosting
provider’ are
leasing the
space, not the
end client.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I
think on this
argument you
would need a
REALLY good
lawyer…..</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Very
different
argument to
the
Megaport/PIPE
issue.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US">
Damien Gardner
Jnr [mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:rendrag@rendrag.net" target="_blank">rendrag@rendrag.net</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b>
Monday, 2
March 2015
8:33 AM<br>
<b>To:</b>
Nathan
Brookfield<br>
<b>Cc:</b>
Paul Wilkins;
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">
ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><br>
<b>Subject:</b>
Re: [AusNOG]
Welcome to
Metadata
Retention</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">But
the customer
is located
within the
facility?
They're
leasing
hardware/space/etc
from you, so
they are your
tenant -
therefore they
are located in
the facility?</p>
</div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">On
2 March 2015
at 08:26,
Nathan
Brookfield
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Nathan.Brookfield@simtronic.com.au" target="_blank">Nathan.Brookfield@simtronic.com.au</a>>
wrote:</p>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">But
you are
providing said
(hosting/colo/dedi/vds)
services in
multiple data
centres and
the actual
customer is
not located
within that
facility, I
think that one
would be hard
pressed to
stand behind.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US">
AusNOG
[mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf
Of </b>Damien
Gardner Jnr<br>
<b>Sent:</b>
Monday, 2
March 2015
6:32 AM<br>
<b>To:</b>
Paul Wilkins<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net"
target="_blank">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b>
Re: [AusNOG]
Welcome to
Metadata
Retention</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">If
you're going
to quote the
Carriage
Service
definition
from the
Telecommunications
Act, you also
need to note
Section 89,
the 'same
premises'
exclusion.
This excludes
services
delivered
inside the
same building,
which reads to
me that
provided
you're only
supplying
internet
services
inside of
Datacenters
(which most
hosting/colo/dedi/vds
companies do),
you're not
providing
carriage
services, and
thus aren't
affected by
this bill?</p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">On
2 March 2015
at 02:51, Paul
Wilkins <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:paulwilkins369@gmail.com"
target="_blank">paulwilkins369@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">The fundamental qualifier is whether you
provide a
'carriage
service', as
defined by the
Telecommunications
Act, 1997.
(The
Broadcasting
Services Act
relies on the
definition in
the Telco
Act).</p>
<div
style="margin-left:30.0pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"><b><i>carriage
service</i></b>
means a
service for
carrying
communications
by means of
guided and/or
unguided
electromagnetic
energy.</p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">If you provide a service (or resell a
service) for
the
termination of
cables or
fiber, you're
clearly within
the scope of
the bill.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">If you don't touch the physical or data
link layers,
the bill may
or may not
apply, subject
to
interpretation
and legal
argument. It's
not clear if a
communication
at the IP
layer is to
the opposite
IP (which
arguably
requires
transmission
by
electromagnetic
energy). Then
again, IP
doesn't deal
with
electromagnetic
radiation, so
perhaps not,
but I wouldn't
think this a
strong
argument.<br>
<br>
Alternatively,
if the
communication
is viewed as
from the IP to
the MAC, then
the
communication
is local and
there is no
transmission
via
electromagnetic
energy (except
from what is
local to the
NIC chipset).
Assuming this
interpretation,
the
IP<>IP
conversation
would be
'content' of
the
MAC<>IP
communication,
and still
remains
outside the
bill.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">As
I've said, the
lawyers will
have a lot of
fun with this.
I'm not a
lawyer and
don't
represent
myself as a
legal expert.
If you need
informed
opinion,
consult a
legal
professional,
or ask the
advice of the
Dep't of
Communications,
who administer
both the Telco
Act, and the
Broadcasting
Services Act.</p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:#888888">Paul Wilkins</span></p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
AusNOG mailing
list<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a></p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br
clear="all">
</p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">--
</p>
<div>
<div>
<p>Damien
Gardner Jnr<br>
VK2TDG. Dip
EE. GradIEAust<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rendrag@rendrag.net" target="_blank">rendrag@rendrag.net</a>
- <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.rendrag.net/" target="_blank">http://www.rendrag.net/</a><u><br>
</u>--<br>
We rode on the
winds of the
rising storm,<br>
We ran to the
sounds of
thunder.<br>
We danced
among the
lightning
bolts,<br>
and tore the
world asunder</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br
clear="all">
</p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">--
</p>
<div>
<div>
<p>Damien
Gardner Jnr<br>
VK2TDG. Dip
EE. GradIEAust<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rendrag@rendrag.net" target="_blank">rendrag@rendrag.net</a>
- <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.rendrag.net/" target="_blank">http://www.rendrag.net/</a><u><br>
</u>--<br>
We rode on the
winds of the
rising storm,<br>
We ran to the
sounds of
thunder.<br>
We danced
among the
lightning
bolts,<br>
and tore the
world asunder</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br clear="all">
</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">--
</p>
<div>
<div>
<p>Damien Gardner
Jnr<br>
VK2TDG. Dip EE.
GradIEAust<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rendrag@rendrag.net" target="_blank">rendrag@rendrag.net</a>
- <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.rendrag.net/" target="_blank">http://www.rendrag.net/</a><u><br>
</u>--<br>
We rode on the
winds of the
rising storm,<br>
We ran to the
sounds of
thunder.<br>
We danced among
the lightning
bolts,<br>
and tore the
world asunder</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
AusNOG mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net"
target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog"
target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br>
<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<br clear="all">
<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding:1.5pt 1.5pt
1.5pt 1.5pt">
<p><img moz-do-not-send="true"
src="imap://pwbrookswork@mail.optusnet.com.au:993/fetch%3EUID%3E.INBOX.Drafts%3E11192?e=view"
alt="DCSI Logo"
height="66" width="150"></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:1.5pt 1.5pt
1.5pt 1.5pt" valign="top">
<p><strong><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif';color:black">Mark
McKibbin</span></strong><span
style="font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif'"><br>
<span
style="color:#666666">Director</span></span></p>
<div
style="border:none;border-bottom:solid
#ff8000 1.0pt;padding:0cm
0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:3.75pt;margin-left:0cm;border:none;padding:0cm"><span
style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif';color:black"> </span></p>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif';color:#999999">DCS
Internet Pty Ltd | 64
Queen St, Warragul VIC
3820<br>
W: <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.dcsi.net.au"
target="_blank">www.dcsi.net.au</a>
| P: 1300 665 575 | F:
1300 556 595 </span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<br clear="all">
<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<p>Damien Gardner Jnr<br>
VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rendrag@rendrag.net"
target="_blank">rendrag@rendrag.net</a>
- <span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.rendrag.net/"
target="_blank">http://www.rendrag.net/</a><u><br>
</u></span>--<br>
We rode on the winds of the rising
storm,<br>
We ran to the sounds of thunder.<br>
We danced among the lightning bolts,<br>
and tore the world asunder</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br>
<span>AusNOG mailing list</span><br>
<span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net"
target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a></span><br>
<span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog"
target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a></span><br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<br clear="all">
<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
<div class="gmail_signature">
<table border="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding:1.5pt 1.5pt 1.5pt 1.5pt">
<p><img moz-do-not-send="true"
src="imap://pwbrookswork@mail.optusnet.com.au:993/fetch%3EUID%3E.INBOX.Drafts%3E11192?e=view"
alt="DCSI Logo" height="66" width="150"></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:1.5pt 1.5pt 1.5pt 1.5pt"
valign="top">
<p><strong><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif';color:black">Mark
McKibbin</span></strong><span
style="font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif'"><br>
<span style="color:#666666">Director</span></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-bottom:solid #ff8000
1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:3.75pt;margin-left:0cm;border:none;padding:0cm"><span
style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif';color:black"> </span></p>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:'Helvetica','sans-serif';color:#999999">DCS
Internet Pty Ltd | 64 Queen St, Warragul VIC
3820<br>
W: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.dcsi.net.au" target="_blank">www.dcsi.net.au</a>
| P: 1300 665 575 | F: 1300 556 595 </span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<br>
<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
AusNOG mailing list
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<br>
<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
AusNOG mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
Nick Stallman<br>
Agentpoint Pty Ltd <br>
The Real Estate Web Developers<br>
Melbourne | Sydney | Miami<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nick@agentpoint.com">nick@agentpoint.com</a><br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.agentpoint.com.au">www.agentpoint.com.au</a> | <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.zooproperty.com">www.zooproperty.com</a> | <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.ginga.com.au">www.ginga.com.au</a> |
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.business2.com.au">www.business2.com.au</a><br>
<br>
Business2.com.au is a real estate agent information website that
helps you understand Portals, Technology and comes with FREE tools
to help your Agency become an online success!</div>
</body>
</html>