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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Back in my day they didn’t have a B.Comp.Sci when I started it was Maths specialising in computing
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D">J</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Personally I found only 1 or 2 course subjects to be ever relevant in my working life.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">What I have found sitting on the “Job seeking” and the “Hiring” side of the fence.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">You get lots of applications for a single position.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">People use a filter to go through applications rightly or wrongly filtering on whether a person has a degree helps to whittle down the list to something more
manageable.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Then I would have a look at real work experience, not certification boot camps..<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I have found<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Ability to learn / problem solve ++++<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Ability to communicate ++++<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Who you know ..<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I don’t think truthful needs to be listed as it should be a given, just like being punctual …<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Doing internships or open source projects, you build a reputation, you get to know people and they you.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Alex<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Chris Gibbs<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, 22 December 2014 2:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Julian De Marchi<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <ausnog@lists.ausnog.net><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] Work experience in networking/telecoms/DCs? Getting my foot in the door?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">+1 Completely agree. It is so easy to fall into the pattern where to expect to find a decent job at the completion of an IT degree.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">Unfortunately that isn't how it works in the real world. I know when I did Computer Science all those years ago, I also ran my own business doing SMB networks that gave me a leg up after
I finished the degree. That leg up was level 1 helpdesk and from there I worked my way up.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">There are always opportunities to find work or gain experience. For example:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">1. Internships. UNSW used to invite(?) global IT companies in that would sprunk (for lack of a better phrase) their companies. Often they would be on the hunt for up-and-coming people
who are still studying. These seminars used to be conducted after lectures and were usually accompanied with pizza and a good chance to chat. I'd highly recommend trying to attend them.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">2. Join an open-source project, open a git-hub account or similar and try to solve a problem that is relevant to where you want to be.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">3. Additional to Uni, grab a subscription to CBT Nuggets and/or Safari online books. Try to learn something outside of the 'fixed' learning environment.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">4. Build a home lab. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">5. If you're in a capital city, join a user group.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">6. start a blog. write about your learning, study or various problems you ran into.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">7. study and grab an industry exam, ie CCNA <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"">In saying all that, Comp Science gave me a great platform for coding in the 'new' devops world. I think that formal education has it's place and for me was invaluable resource that contributed
to where I am today.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black">Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<h4 style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:middle"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#0077C5"><img id="_x0000_i1025" src="http://www.gravatar.com/avatar/6317ed025faeb1698ce6a8458e625f0d.png"> Chris Gibbs </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#444444;font-weight:normal">Network
Engineer (Team Lead)</span><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#0077C5"><o:p></o:p></span></h4>
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<p style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#999999">Ask us about web hosting...<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, Dec 22, 2014 at 2:22 PM, Julian De Marchi <<a href="mailto:julian@jdcomputers.com.au" target="_blank">julian@jdcomputers.com.au</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 12/22/14 13:19, Cameron Worts wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">What’s the point of going out and getting an expensive degree when most employers want employees with these requirements?<o:p></o:p></p>
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This. The same problem occurred to me while I was studying. The only solution was to start at the very bottom and work my way up. Which IMHO was a very good approach in the end.<br>
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I worked my way up from Level 1 support to where I am now, systems/network monkey.<span style="color:#888888"><br>
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<span class="hoenzb">--julian</span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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