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    As in an independent contractor, I have a whale of a time with this
    stuff.<br>
    For every client stuck in a loop, attempting to talk to some call
    centre somewhere,<br>
    and following a script, which the individual doesn't understand, nor
    care, they<br>
    hang up and call their local "go to" guy.<br>
    <br>
    And I spring a few dollars out of them for resetting the router,
    checking the line, and<br>
    making sure the DSL connection is up and running. And maybe spring
    another few dollars<br>
    checking they actually do have anti-virus, and not an ancient
    subscription to Nortons<br>
    that expired in 1999.<br>
    <br>
    It isn't hard, but I can understand how the average punter feels
    about all this.<br>
    They bought a service, and it stopped working.<br>
    <br>
    So.... they call the provider.........and it all turns to custard
    after that.<br>
    A bunch of people who talk a different language- and I'm not talking
    about<br>
    call centres in the Philippines, just the guy on the phone.<br>
    <br>
    Joe Blow wouldn't know a DSL filter from a Rothman's Filter.<br>
    And more importantly, he doesn't care.<br>
    <br>
    Something broke, and he wants it fixed.<br>
    <br>
    If you are an ISP, you need to sort this stuff out better, or cut me
    a slice to<br>
    do it for you. (Sorry-delete that... I already have enough ISP
    fallout to deal with)<br>
    <br>
    Not that it matters too much, I already do this anyway.<br>
    And I take the dollar off the end user, rather than rely on some
    corporate payment<br>
    scenario that often gets "delayed".<br>
    <br>
    My reputation is good- how about yours?<br>
    <br>
    And don't get me started on the price of spare parts for HP/Compaq
    gear.<br>
    Yes, I am an electronics bod, with a few clues on the rest of the
    stuff.<br>
    <br>
    Fighting the FUD is my mission.<br>
    Computers are simple. <br>
    Corporates complicate things for a reason, mostly to do with
    marketing.<br>
    Routers are simple- see the above.<br>
    People are complicated, and need to be restrained.<br>
    Or re-trained.<br>
    <br>
    Alan<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/11/2014 8:55 p.m., Mark Dignam
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote cite="mid:03e101cffd84$d8c82720$8a587560$@innaloo.net"
      type="cite">
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Real
            World CEO Answer: Cut both – Engineers are only a drain on
            the spreadsheet, and customer facing staff just need to
            knuckle down and work harder. And less wages means happy
            shareholders and more options for the board.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">the
            sad fact is – its often a true answer </span><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D">L</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">dig.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext"
                  lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext"
                lang="EN-US"> AusNOG
                [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net">mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>] <b>On Behalf
                  Of </b>Shane Short<br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, 11 November 2014 3:33 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> Shain Singh<br>
                <b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] TPG NOC CONTACT<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">I'm not saying I disagree/agree either way,
          but would you rather cut costs on some customer facing staff
          which a smaller percentage of your customer base utilises day
          to day, or do you cut it from infrastructure/engineering,
          which all your customer base uses?<br>
          <br>
          It's a tricky one that I don't have the answer for.<br>
          <br>
          -Shane<br>
          <br>
          Shain Singh wrote: <o:p></o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          <div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal">On 11 November 2014 18:11, Shane
                Short <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:shane@short.id.au" target="_blank">shane@short.id.au</a>>
                wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">To be honest-- getting someone
                  who's capable of doing that level of troubleshooting
                  ad-hoc is hard, especially if you don't have the
                  budgets because you're in a price war with your
                  competitors.<o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">Bingo! And that's the mindset
                  across the board with small and large players - that
                  budgetary constraints mean that staff is typically the
                  first place to look for cost cutting.<o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">When I worked years ago at KBS
                  Internet and also Connect.com we only had a T2
                  helpdesk to deal with corporates/wholesales. I also
                  had config access to ALL core/dist/edge routers and
                  sudo access to hosting servers, etc. Things have
                  changed since those days, but they could do it, so
                  surely others can....<o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">We are now stuck in a world where
                  the members of this list hire T1 people themselves and
                  expect better service from the T1 staff of their
                  transit providers. T1 skill-sets don't really change
                  much in companies, and nor do their pay grades. <o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
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            <p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all">
              <o:p></o:p></p>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
            </div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">-- <o:p></o:p></p>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal">Shaineel Singh<br>
                e: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:shain.singh@gmail.com" target="_blank">shain.singh@gmail.com</a><br>
                p: +61 422 921 951<br>
                w: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="http://buffet.shainsingh.com" target="_blank">http://buffet.shainsingh.com</a><br>
                <br>
                --<br>
                "Too many have dispensed with generosity to practice
                charity" - Albert Camus<o:p></o:p></p>
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      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  
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