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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-AU link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>you oughta see the extraordinary power of DPI systems nowadays Ben!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>also, they often operate at L2<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>-P<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Ben Grubb [mailto:bgrubb@fairfaxmedia.com.au] <br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, 28 September 2014 1:30 PM<br><b>To:</b> Paul Wallace<br><b>Cc:</b> Mark ZZZ Smith; Geordie Guy; Skeeve Stevens; ausnog@ausnog.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] George Brandis - Be Warned<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>I question how much surveillance can be done at the NBN Co level. Can someone enlighten me on that?<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Aren't they just layer 2?<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Regards,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Ben Grubb<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 28 September 2014 13:27, Paul Wallace <<a href="mailto:paul.wallace@mtgi.com.au" target="_blank">paul.wallace@mtgi.com.au</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Given the Gov seems committed to this policy I'm surprised they haven't instructed NBNCo to embark on early compliance.<br><br>.. or maybe they have already??<br><span style='color:#888888'><br><span class=hoenzb>-P</span></span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><br><br><br><br>-----Original Message-----<br>From: AusNOG [mailto:<a href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>] On Behalf Of Mark ZZZ Smith<br>Sent: Sunday, 28 September 2014 10:48 AM<br>To: Geordie Guy; Skeeve Stevens<br>Cc: <a href="mailto:ausnog@ausnog.net">ausnog@ausnog.net</a><br>Subject: Re: [AusNOG] George Brandis - Be Warned<br><br>I think you've forgotten what the AusNOG acronym stands for or forgotten what is in the charter - it's the Australian Network *O*perator's *G*roup. It's fundamentally a technical group.<br><br>ISOC-AU (<a href="http://www.isoc-au.org.au/" target="_blank">http://www.isoc-au.org.au/</a> )and/or EFA (<a href="https://www.efa.org.au/" target="_blank">https://www.efa.org.au/</a>) are the appropriate groups for this discussion.<br><br><br>>________________________________<br>> From: Geordie Guy <<a href="mailto:elomis@gmail.com">elomis@gmail.com</a>><br>>To: Skeeve Stevens <<a href="mailto:skeeve%2Bausnog@eintellegonetworks.com">skeeve+ausnog@eintellegonetworks.com</a>><br>>Cc: "<a href="mailto:ausnog@ausnog.net">ausnog@ausnog.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:ausnog@ausnog.net">ausnog@ausnog.net</a>><br>>Sent: Saturday, 27 September 2014, 18:05<br>>Subject: Re: [AusNOG] George Brandis - Be Warned<br>><br>><br>><br>><br>><br>><br>><br>>On Sat, Sep 27, 2014 at 2:02 PM, Skeeve Stevens <<a href="mailto:skeeve%2Bausnog@eintellegonetworks.com">skeeve+ausnog@eintellegonetworks.com</a>> wrote:<br>><br>><rant><br>>><br>>><br>>>George Brandis - I hope you read this and understand.<br>>><br>>><br>>>The following article is an example of what we, the tech industry WILL do if you persist on trying to control the Internet, in Australia or anywhere else.<br>>><br>>><br>><br>><br>>LOL<br>><br>><br>>Prove it.<br>><br>><br>>The state of the Australian network operator community is such that Brandis is quite sure, if he has an IQ above room temperature, that he can do literally anything he likes to the community and industry and in response he'll get someone who is community and society minded issuing a call to arms to the AusNOG list that will be met with between 1 and 3 people complaining that the email doesn't contain a traceroute pertaining to a specific, current routing issue where someone going via a peer is getting a packet or two dropped and want to know if other people using the same peering have the same problem.<br>><br>><br>>Seriously.<br>><br>><br>>If you want to issue threats to politicians who are expediting the ISP and carrier industry into a collection of Australian businesses whose primary business models are issuing copyright infringement notices, wholesale aggregating and delivering user metadata and policing what websites their customers can access in the lens of current government policy about what people should do, you might want to check that the industry gives a proverbial.<br>><br>><br>>Every attempt at engaging the AusNOG community to care about these issues falls on the deaf ears of operators that just want to get through their shift and have convinced themselves that other people will sort it out if there's a genuine problem.<br>><br>><br>>Skeeve if you ever want to work with someone to oppose this sort of stuff contact me directly. There's two of us, we can find more offlist.<br>><br>><br>><br>>_______________________________________________<br>>AusNOG mailing list<br>><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>><a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br>><br>><br>><br>_______________________________________________<br>AusNOG mailing list<br><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br><a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br>_______________________________________________<br>AusNOG mailing list<br><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br><a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222;background:white'>The information contained in this e-mail message and any accompanying files is or may be confidential. 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