<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt"><div><span>So let me play devils advocate here, what would you like them to do ?</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>The way I see it they (Melb IT) have two options:</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color:
transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>1. You delegate the hosting to other NS, they drop the zone from their NS (which is what has been said below, how it happens NOW)</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>2. They keep the zone active on their NS while you set it up at another provider and then at some later point in time you/they have to remove it from their NS</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal;
background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>I think we'd all agree that it's pointless (and bad form) to have zones kicking around on your NS that are not delegated to that NS. It's untidy and worse case is it will produce false replies for anyone that happens to try and lookup something from that zone from the 'old' NS.</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal;
background-color: transparent;"><span>So if they were to go with the 2nd option they run the risk that this will happen, old/stale zones that are no longer delegated to Melb IT NS, but still exist on them. The only way to avoid these stale zones would be to either:</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span style="font-size: 13.63636302948px; background-color: transparent;"><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span style="font-size: 13.63636302948px; background-color: transparent;">i)</span><span style="font-size: 13.63636302948px; background-color: transparent;">. Rely on customer to
delete them (or create a ticket to say migration was complete and they can now be deleted).</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span style="font-size: 13.63636302948px; background-color: transparent;">ii). Have some sort of script that runs on a daily/weekly basis and compares zones delegated to zones that exist on NS and delete any zones that are no longer delegated to Melb IT NS.</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>We all know that relying on customers to do anything is fraught with problems. If you want it done, you need to do it yourself. Also remember that a good proportion of Melb IT customers may not be so DNS literate.</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>If they scripted it, you just increase your work load, have potential for problem and still potentially have people who would complain because the script ran at 2300 Friday and they had started the redelegation process at 2200 Friday (ie. 1
hour before script start) and so they still wanted the domain to stay on the old NS for another few days (of course you could mitigate against this by checking each day and flagging stuff as "to be deleted" then leaving it for a few more days before it actually gets deleted, but really how far do you take this !)</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal;
background-color: transparent;"><span>It's a bit of a hard line, but I can see where they are coming from. It hopefully produces the most consistent result for all at the end of the day and saves them wasting resources. You're no longer wishing to use their NS, why should the zone continue to exist on their NS ?</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal;
background-color: transparent;"><span>At least now that you know about it, you can factor it into your migration process.</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>regards,</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande',
sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>Tony.</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302948px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div><br></div> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 10pt;"> <div style="font-family: 'times new roman', 'new york', times, serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <hr size="1"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> Joseph Goldman <joe@apcs.com.au><br> <b><span style="font-weight:
bold;">To:</span></b> ausnog@lists.ausnog.net <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, 3 September 2014 9:54 AM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [AusNOG] Am I being unreasonable.... MelbourneIT<br> </font> </div> <div class="y_msg_container"><br>Yikes thats harsh.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">See if you can set your TTL's down real low for the important records <br clear="none">(A, MX etc) wait a day or 2 then do it - at least hopefully then the <br clear="none">world is aware of low TTL and the time from them removing from their <br clear="none">NS's to servers checking your new ones should be quick.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">On 03/09/14 09:50, Alex Samad - Yieldbroker wrote:<br clear="none">> Yep that was my thought.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> So I have setup my master DNS, setup my secondary, tested against their NS.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> Went
to the Melbourne IT site.<br clear="none">> Went to re delegate... then it says you can't, you have to un manage it from MelbourneIT and it has to be done first.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> Basically it deletes it from their NS servers, happens almost immediately, I checked against their NS servers.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> I have a few domains that I am looking at moving over... So this is going to be a painful task.<br clear="none">><br clear="none">> Alex<br clear="none">><br clear="none">>> -----Original Message-----<br clear="none">>> From: Jonathan Thorpe [mailto:<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:jthorpe@Conexim.com.au" href="mailto:jthorpe@Conexim.com.au">jthorpe@Conexim.com.au</a>]<br clear="none">>> Sent: Wednesday, 3 September 2014 9:43 AM<br clear="none">>> To: Alex Samad - Yieldbroker; <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net"
href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a><br clear="none">>> Subject: RE: Am I being unreasonable.... MelbourneIT<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> Hi Alex,<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> That doesn't sound right to me.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> The domain delegation and authoritative DNS are usually handled<br clear="none">>> independently.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> It should be a matter of:<br clear="none">>> 1. Set up the DNS records on the new service.<br clear="none">>> 2. Re-delegate the domain to the new nameservers.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> If you've set up new nameservers with new records already, then you should<br clear="none">>> be able to login to the Melbourne IT management console and perform the<br clear="none">>> re-delegation yourself.<br clear="none">>><br
clear="none">>> Once this is done, allow 24-48 hours for the change to propagate (this will<br clear="none">>> depend on the TTLs), then cancel the DNS service.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> Kind Regards,<br clear="none">>> Jonathan Thorpe<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> --<br clear="none">>> Conexim Australia Pty. Limited | www.conexim.com.au<br clear="none">>> Phone: 1300 133 900 | Fax: 1300 851 747 | Direct: 02 8214 5804 Managed<br clear="none">>> Hosting Excellence | Australian Government Endorsed Supplier<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> PRIVATE & CONFIDENTIAL<br clear="none">>> This email message and attachments contain information that is confidential<br clear="none">>> to Conexim Australia Pty Limited. If you are not the intended
recipient you<br clear="none">>> are not permitted to use, copy or distribute the message and or attachments<br clear="none">>> in any manner. If you have received this email in error, please inform the<br clear="none">>> sender by return email immediately and delete all copies of the message and<br clear="none">>> any attachments. Conexim Australia Pty Limited is not responsible for any<br clear="none">>> unauthorised changes made to this email or its attachments. This notice<br clear="none">>> should not be removed.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> -----Original Message-----<br clear="none">>> From: AusNOG [mailto:<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net" href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>] On Behalf Of Alex<br clear="none">>> Samad -
Yieldbroker<br clear="none">>> Sent: Wednesday, 3 September 2014 9:34 AM<br clear="none">>> To: <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net" href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a><br clear="none">>> Subject: [AusNOG] Am I being unreasonable.... MelbourneIT<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> Hi<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> So I have decided to move my zone from Melbourne IT.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> But there is a hitch, seems like Melbourne IT will delete my zone off their NS<br clear="none">>> before they start the root re delegation.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> Just spent a 10-15 min talking to their support (24x7), which is really only 10-5.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> I remember before, you just went to a web site with your zone key made<br clear="none">>> the NS changes and off
you go. Takes 24-48 hours for it to propagate<br clear="none">>> depending on TTL's. Now that function seems to be with the registrars and<br clear="none">>> Melbourne IT don't want to play nice.<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> Seems to be like they are just making it hard to move off melbIT...<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> A<br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>><br clear="none">>> _______________________________________________<br clear="none">>> AusNOG mailing list<br clear="none">>> <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br clear="none">>> <a shape="rect" href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yqt0403859206" id="yqtfd04863"><br
clear="none">> _______________________________________________<br clear="none">> AusNOG mailing list<br clear="none">> <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br clear="none">> <a shape="rect" href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br clear="none"><br clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">AusNOG mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br clear="none"></div><br><br></div> </div> </div> </div></body></html>