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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Remembering that Telstra do peer with
Optus, and AAPT (now TPG), Cloudfare could buy paid transit
through Optus Wholesale, or set up a competitive tender between
two or three, to get Telstra's routes. The bandwidth differential
shojldn't be anywhere near the ratio claimed.<br>
<br>
Or they can stick to the peering points, not get Telstra's routes,
and force Telstra to haul all the Cloudflare traffic on Telstra's
international links from somewhere else, making peering a
cost-benefit equation for Telstra to do the sums on.<br>
<br>
Many ways to skin the cat. Of course, publishing a 'name and
shame' article is one strategy, but unlikely to be effective at
bringing about change.<br>
<br>
P.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 27/08/2014 9:59 AM, Ben Grubb wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAE1YzcZ=3xgVTnKE-F2a5UnOu5HOmvjxZv5JCMTR0FCwUdLSGg@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">"<span
style="font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">That
Telstra has a lot of customers, and is using them to grab some
extra</span><br
style="font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">money,
isn't great, and it should be publicised. But it ain't an
issue of</span><br
style="font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">net
neutrality, unless Telstra (or someone else) is actually doing
(or is</span><br
style="font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">planning
on doing) the sort of things that US carriers *are* doing."</span>
<div>
<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br>
</span></div>
<div><font face="arial, sans-serif">They perhaps aren't slowing
down services or prioritising one over another like some in
the US, no. Though they <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/telstra-to-clamp-down-on-peertopeer-20130205-2dvus.html"
target="_blank">were planning</a> to do that a while back
and the <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.afr.com/p/technology/accc_takes_aim_at_internet_slowdowns_DNxYfamGg7IZdqO1IcZC1L"
target="_blank">ACCC eventually raised its eyebrows</a>.</font></div>
<div><font face="arial, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="arial, sans-serif">But aren't they speeding up
those who pay and therefore creating an artificial slow lane
for every other service?</font></div>
<div>
<font face="arial, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="arial, sans-serif">Your service has to go
through more hops unless you pay them or a transit provider
money. This happens around the globe with other monopolies,
sure, but it doesn't mean it's right. Hence by question over
whether we should regulate interconnection.</font></div>
<div><font face="arial, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="arial, sans-serif">"</font><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">Frankly,
if Netflix wanted to really put the cat amongst the pigeons,
it'd</span></div>
<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">come
in with a great service and pay Telstra for "transit" (only
actually</span><br
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">
<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">using
them as a last-resort provider for routes it can't get
elsewhere, to</span><br
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">
<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">minimise
traffic costs) -- for a time."</span>
<div>
<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br>
</span></div>
<div>They could so that.... but why would they when they could
just open in a market where it's cheaper before here?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
As CloudFlare points out, it's 20X Europe for bandwidth here
and Telstra is apparently to blame for a lot of this.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Regards,</div>
<div>Ben Grubb</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 27 August 2014 09:28, Matt Palmer <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mpalmer@hezmatt.org" target="_blank">mpalmer@hezmatt.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div class="">On Wed, Aug 27, 2014 at 12:08:53AM +1000, Ben
Grubb wrote:<br>
> Net neutrality has barely rated a mention in
Australia since 2008.<br>
<br>
</div>
That's because Net Neutrality, in the terms it is discussed
in the US, isn't<br>
an issue here. No provider here can (currently) pull the
sort of<br>
shenanigans that the big US providers can, because if they
did they would<br>
lose a lot of market share, because we have competition.
The core issue in<br>
the debate in the US isn't the Internet, it's monopolies
behaving badly.<br>
I'm not talking about "dominant market positions", either (a
la Telstra),<br>
but rather honest-to-goodness "we're the phone^Wcable
company, we don't have<br>
to care" exploitation of the fact that there is only one
provider of<br>
Internet services across large portions of the US.<br>
<br>
That Telstra has a lot of customers, and is using them to
grab some extra<br>
money, isn't great, and it should be publicised. But it
ain't an issue of<br>
net neutrality, unless Telstra (or someone else) is actually
doing (or is<br>
planning on doing) the sort of things that US carriers *are*
doing.<br>
<br>
Frankly, if Netflix wanted to really put the cat amongst the
pigeons, it'd<br>
come in with a great service and pay Telstra for "transit"
(only actually<br>
using them as a last-resort provider for routes it can't get
elsewhere, to<br>
minimise traffic costs) -- for a time. Collect up a huge
pile of Telstra<br>
customers, then say "oh, we've realised that it isn't
cost-effective to<br>
service Telstra customers their Netflix, so we'd suggest
moving to another<br>
provider because Telstra customers are going to lose their
Netflix as of<br>
date X". I don't *know* what would happen, but I'd suspect
that, given that<br>
people have a lot more choice in ISP than they do in movie
provider, Telstra<br>
would lose a lot more customers than Netflix would. And,
given that Netflix<br>
would no longer be paying for Telstra "transit", it'd be a
net win on the<br>
balance sheet.<br>
<br>
Normally I wouldn't imagine any company doing that sort of
thing, but given<br>
Netflix' recent forays into displaying "Your video is shit
because $ISP is<br>
congested" messages (something I'd long-thought they
*should* do, but never<br>
imagined they *would* do) I think there's some small chance
they might<br>
actually do something like that. They can't do it in the
US, because over<br>
there, as much as you might *want* to change ISPs, you
physically *can't*.<br>
Over here... not so much.<br>
<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
- Matt<br>
</font></span>
<div class="HOEnZb">
<div class="h5"><br>
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