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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-AU link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>In response to: “Yes I use crappy ADSL, I use it because i have no other option. Would I buy a fibre service if it was available for me? Yes.”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>… 4G services are sometimes far faster than ADSL2+ so why not but one of those instead?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Surely you’re not suggesting fibre be subsidised to the point where it turns up at DSL prices? <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>If you agree that 4G offers plenty enough speed at the moment then why not also suggest that the Government buy Telstra’s 4G network & then make a subsidised service available to you right way, so we can all sit at home endlessly watching NetFlix pics?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Oh that would be prejudicial to Optus & VHA you say … no more than the previous NBN in buying two networks & competing with all the others .. it would be the same.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>If it’s that important to you & 4G doesn’t work for you, you could move into a building that’s serviced by ‘Open Networks’ TODAY & get your hands on an NBN style service @ 100/40Mb & pay probably LESS than you’d pay the NBNco!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>But what you CANNOT do is to criticise TPG for rolling out FTTB, complain that 4G is not good enough, not move to a place that offers Open Networks & CONTINUE to suggest that the Government MUST roll out FTTP.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>We all need to take a deep breath<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>-P<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jacob Gardiner<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, 22 July 2014 9:03 AM<br><b>To:</b> Sam Silvester; Mark ZZZ Smith; AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] Netflix in AU, break up Go4, or TPG peering breakup?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><br>Yes, but not to download content for which I don't have the copyright owner's permission. I hold copyright on work (that I've chosen to give away for free), if I don't respect others' copyright, how can I expect them to respect mine?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></blockquote></div><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>Good for you, I too hold copywrite, but that’s not the point.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><br>These sorts of assertions are typical 'Whirlpool' pejorative assertions, rather than ones that reflect reality.<br><br>You assert that ADSL connections are 'crappy'. If that were the case, then how come it is being used to deliver over 4 Million Internet services in Australia, more than 5 times the next most popular wired technology? (<a href="http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/Lookup/8153.0Chapter3December%202013">http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/Lookup/8153.0Chapter3December%202013</a>) (Are you using 'crappy' ADSL? If so, why?)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></blockquote></div><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>They are crappy, how can you say that Australian broadband is not sub-par?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>Yes I use crappy ADSL, I use it because i have no other option. Would I buy a fibre service if it was available for me? Yes.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>It’s used <i>‘more than 5 times’ </i>anything else because it’s the best available consumer product in the market. It still buffers, there’s still geo-blocks for much of the content people want to watch. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>And for me personally I want to watch high definition, not low definition cartoons/a buffering spinning wheel.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><br><br>You assert that the only way for people to attain their favourite shows is via bittorrent, yet I and others have been watching streaming video over ADSL from the ABC, SBS and Youtube for in the order of more than 5 years, including over a 3Mbps ADSL link in my previous residence.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></blockquote></div><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>And the streams that i watch have their “low” setting at 1600Kbps. They need to be high definition because otherwise I can’t actually see what’s going on, let alone the hockey puck in an NHL match.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><br><br>You assert that only Netflix is able to provide streaming content that people want to buy, which is why the government must sponsor its entry into the Australian market. Yet I've watched a number of movies recently on Google Play, and my 2.5 year old "Smart TV" has had Quickflix and Sony's VoD service clients available from day one (as did the "Smart" blu-ray player I bought at the same time). If availability of GoT is the measure, then all four seasons of GoT are available via Google Play, so it can be streamed legally rather than illegally downloaded. Right now there are a number of VoD services available to Australians, without Netflix being in the market, so why should they get a free kick from the government over the existing *and* smaller players?<br><br>Many people on this list can't afford to be 'armchair network engineers' like those who make Whirlpool-type assertions can, because real money is being spent on real infrastructure and we have or have had real customers, and have real faults to deal with. What works well enough and what delivers what the customers want for a price they will pay is what matters, not religious zealotry about FTTH being the only God worth worshipping. (And If you look at the above ABS link, if there is any Internet access technology worshipping going on, it's the mobile and fixed wireless God being worshipped, delivering Internet connections in numbers nearly equivalent to all others combined.)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>Armchair engineer? Whirlpool? Right, So engineering doesn’t have much to do with this conversation, but fast and reliable access to good networks is related, something which you’re obviously not wanting because you’re happy with your 3Mbps DSL sync. Just because you’re happy sitting around and watching low definition anime on a shitty connection doesn’t mean that the rest of us who may need high quality connectivity are. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>And Netflix with 200,000+ Australian based subscribers already using the service it seems i’m not the only one in this spot.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>The thing I really really like about something like Netflix coming to town is that it creates a need for a whole range of re-thinking the way that our industry operates, which is something I strongly believe Australia needs if we’re ever going to become a country that does something more than mining exports. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>IMO the government needs to facilitate the set up of companies like Netflix, not give them a free ride, and not necessarily Netflix alone. Why? Because it encourages a whole range of improvements that the rest of the industries would get a major boost from. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>This kind of boost would probably keep a lot of our local companies on-shore. We’ve lost almost every decent tech startup to London or the US West coast 10 years, because we simply don’t have a market, or the infrastructure to facilitate them. We are 12-18 months behind and there doesn’t appear to be any sign of us closing that gap. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>Netflix are very vocal about their issues with ISPs in the US that make the end-user’s experience worse, all in order to line their own pockets. Why wouldn’t a company like that be welcome here to let rip on the Go4 and bad infrastructure decisions? Sure, Netflix don’t need to set up here in AU but if that’s the case then they’re going to be even more dependant on the end-users ISP having reliable connectivity, otherwise their customers simply won’t keep their subscription active. It’s all about customer experience, and just because you’re willing to wait for a buffer to fill on your 3Mbps DSL whilst your new smart fridge downloads a new firmware update doesn’t mean that the regular joe next door would be. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></body></html>