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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-AU link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Too late .. the horse has bolted.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The previous Government went down the path of effectively buying some of the Carrier infrastructure but did so in a profoundly prejudicial way.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>-P<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Alex Samad - Yieldbroker<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, 21 July 2014 3:57 PM<br><b>To:</b> AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] Netflix in AU, break up Go4, or TPG peering breakup?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I think… real life example<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The government build roads (and they should continue to). It to the advantage of every one, and help business. Network access should be run by the government remove the commercial interest in locking people in etc etc<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Services should be what companies compete on, that’s sort of the picture I saw when I read about the original NBN.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Telstra should never have been allowed to take the copper into private land…. When it was sold off<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Alex<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> AusNOG [<a href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net">mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Sam Silvester<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, 21 July 2014 3:52 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] Netflix in AU, break up Go4, or TPG peering breakup?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Netflix aren't interested in the last mile, the Government doesn't need to do anything for their service to Just Work here (it already does, for anybody with Google search skills and an interest in using it. It's not just technically savvy users, I can guarantee you).<br><br>So that leaves peering etc. If it's commercially sane for Netflix to put a cache in to a given network, they will. Likewise, if it's commercially sane for them to peer on an IX or locate CDN nodes in Sydney, they will.<br><br>The Government doesn't need to get involved. As Mark says - if it doesn't make commercial sense to do either of the above, they'll just deliver via the US. Easy.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Mon, Jul 21, 2014 at 3:02 PM, Jacob Gardiner <<a href="mailto:jacob@jacobgardiner.com" target="_blank">jacob@jacobgardiner.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>Do you use ADSL?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>Have you ever used a torrent?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>I’d say most people who are interested in watching their favourite shows do so by leaving their torrent client open overnight, on a crappy ADSL connection. They’d all be be extremely happy to pay $10 per month and get something like netflix in their home. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>So yeah, our market is inhibited and citizens work around it by going the slow, illegal route. If you bring netflix to town, i’d probably also say that our favourite government would need to re-evaluate our broadband network(s) for starters.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#888888'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#888888'>-- <br>Jacob Gardiner<br><a href="https://twitter.com/jacobgardiner" target="_blank">@jacobgardiner</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p><span style='color:black'>On 21 July 2014 at 2:53:47 pm, Mark ZZZ Smith (<a href="mailto:markzzzsmith@yahoo.com.au" target="_blank">markzzzsmith@yahoo.com.au</a>) wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'>By saying we should be 'enabling businesses like Netflix', you're implying they're currently 'disabled'. How?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:3.75pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center;background:white'><span style='color:black'><hr size=1 width="100%" align=center></span></div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><b><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> Jacob Gardiner <<a href="mailto:jacob@jacobgardiner.com" target="_blank">jacob@jacobgardiner.com</a>><br><b>To:</b> Sam Silvester <<a href="mailto:sam.silvester@gmail.com" target="_blank">sam.silvester@gmail.com</a>>; Mark ZZZ Smith <<a href="mailto:markzzzsmith@yahoo.com.au" target="_blank">markzzzsmith@yahoo.com.au</a>>; "<a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a>><br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, 21 July 2014 2:45 PM<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] Netflix in AU, break up Go4, or TPG peering breakup?</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'>My point is that we should be enabling businesses like Netflix. I’m not saying anybody should get special treatment. Hypothetically if Netflix were to come on-shore and blow away Quickflix because they’re better then I have no problem with that. In fact they may help influence a change in policy that might make business easier for other VOD suppliers. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'>We’ve got issues. When a company like Netflix comes to town, these issues are forced and hopefully resolved with benefits to the entire market, not just Netflix. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'>-- <br>Jacob Gardiner<br><a href="https://twitter.com/jacobgardiner" target="_blank">@jacobgardiner</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='color:black'>On 21 July 2014 at 2:39:51 pm, Mark ZZZ Smith (<a href="mailto:markzzzsmith@yahoo.com.au" target="_blank">markzzzsmith@yahoo.com.au</a>) wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='color:black'>And why should Netflix get special treatment? Why not Quickflix, Google Play or (shock horror) FoxTel. Why not my about-to-incorporate-if-I-get-free-taxpayer-money VOD company MarkSmithFlix?<br><br>If you believe in network neutrality, then you shouldn't believe in anybody getting preferential treatment, whether that preferential treatment is in the form of government sponsorship, regulation or even zero metering of some content providers' content but not others by ISPs.<br><br>Netflix should come to Australia because they want to, and they'd want to if they can make a suitable profit. Any preferential treatment of them penalises every other VoD player.<br><br><br>>________________________________<br>> From: Sam Silvester <<a href="mailto:sam.silvester@gmail.com" target="_blank">sam.silvester@gmail.com</a>><br>>To: "<a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a>><br>>Sent: Monday, 21 July 2014 12:05 PM<br>>Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Netflix in AU, break up Go4, or TPG peering breakup?<br>><br>><br>><br>>I'm curious as to why anybody thinks there needs to be a Government response here - not to mention it's all hypothetical so far anyway.<br>><br>>If/when Netflix come to AU, why would their model be any different to elsewhere? Caches for networks that justify them, and building their CDN out to peering points that make sense.<br>><br>><br>>It's what they have done elsewhere, why would anybody think here would be a special or different case?<br>><br>><br>><br>>On Mon, Jul 21, 2014 at 11:19 AM, Jacob Gardiner <<a href="mailto:jacob@jacobgardiner.com" target="_blank">jacob@jacobgardiner.com</a>> wrote:<br>><br>><br>>><br>>><br>>>On 21 July 2014 at 11:18:36 am, Mark Newton (<a href="mailto:newton@atdot.dotat.org" target="_blank">newton@atdot.dotat.org</a>) wrote:<br>>>The Government is entirely impotent in this area. They cannot force an offshore provider to make decisions which are suboptimal to their business.<br>>>This is exactly where the mindset needs to change. <br>>>If the Government wants a business like Netflix and many others to invest into Australia’s market then there should be incentives to do so. <br>>>Or we could just wait until we run out of rocks to dig up WA then freak out.<br>>>_______________________________________________<br>>>AusNOG mailing list<br>>><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>>><a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br>>><br>>><br>><br>><br>>_______________________________________________<br>>AusNOG mailing list<br>><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>><a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br>><br>><br>><br>_______________________________________________<br>AusNOG mailing list<br><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net" target="_blank">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br><a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog" target="_blank">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></div></body></html>