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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dear Ankit<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Due to the fact Australia is quite small (not that many people and or networks plus the cost of bandwidth is still much more than the USA/Europe) you will find there are not that many people who run serious large hardware routers… lots of cisco 7200 still out their because they are working fine… 1gbit of transit is still considered heaps (for most networks that aren’t transit providers) <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Over time I see 7200’s being replaced with Juniper MX-5’s or Brocade CER’s because of the price point from Juniper and Brocade.. and from memory those models are the only true hardware routers which are small in capacity and cost effective which can be upgraded with additional licenses… thus a perfect starting point for someone looking to replace the cisco 7200 platform.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Anything larger ie MX240/480 and ASR 9000 / MLXe are very big routers for the average network and I doubt many are sold locally each year… (could be wrong… however)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Kindest Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>James Braunegg<br></span></b><b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>W:</span></b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> 1300 769 972 | <b>M:</b> 0488 997 207 | <b>D:</b> (03) 9751 7616</span><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>E:</span></b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="mailto:james.braunegg@micron21.com"><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>james.braunegg@micron21.com</span></a></span><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> | <b>ABN:</b> 12 109 977 666 <br><br><img border=0 width=250 height=39 id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image001.jpg@01CE0D52.5024A020" alt="Description: Description: Description: Description: M21.jpg"><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><br></span><span lang=EN-AU style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>This message is intended for the addressee named above. It may contain privileged or confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you must not use, copy, distribute or disclose it to anyone other than the addressee. If you have received this message in error please return the message to the sender by replying to it and then delete the message from your computer.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net [mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Ankit Agrawal<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, February 14, 2013 3:50 PM<br><b>To:</b> McDonald Richards; AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] powerful routers in core/edge routing/switching<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Macca, agree, it might not be a necessity for majority of people.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Need to understand what is best on a technical level first and obviously commercials will follow. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>I haven't really seen anyone criticising what they are using from the options that I listed below which is sort of what I thought as well. They all can do the job which sort of makes it harder to decide which one to pick. You just need to look at what is going to best suite the infrastructure where the product will be deployed and obviously cater for future scalability.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Ankit.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>From: </span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>McDonald Richards <<a href="mailto:McDonald.Richards@vocus.com.au">McDonald.Richards@vocus.com.au</a>><br><b>Date: </b>Thursday, 14 February 2013 9:02 AM<br><b>To: </b>"<a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a>><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [AusNOG] powerful routers in core/edge routing/switching<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>You're right – some times it's not enough, but I don't think that is the case for the majority of people who are carrying a full BGP table. If you can afford all that connectivity and caching, you can probably afford to buy a router that is suitable to support it all (provided all the afore mentioned caching and connectivity is actually a requirement of the business).<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Macca<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>From: </span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Ankit Agrawal <<a href="mailto:ankitagrawals@gmail.com">ankitagrawals@gmail.com</a>><br><b>Date: </b>Wednesday, 13 February 2013 12:50 PM<br><b>To: </b>McDonald Richards <<a href="mailto:McDonald.Richards@vocus.com.au">McDonald.Richards@vocus.com.au</a>>, "<a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a>><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [AusNOG] powerful routers in core/edge routing/switching<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Sometimes default route is not enough and you do need to be aware of full routing table, including local peering to have optimum routing both from cost and user experience perspective. This is especially the case when you are not running a single IP feed from one or two providers but infact have several transit links and peering/caching services. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Of course there are ways to overcome these issues, but then as you said, you end up in a web of network that only you can understand and support and its beyond documentation.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Ankit.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>From: </span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>McDonald Richards <<a href="mailto:McDonald.Richards@vocus.com.au">McDonald.Richards@vocus.com.au</a>><br><b>Date: </b>Wednesday, 13 February 2013 8:15 AM<br><b>To: </b>"<a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a>><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [AusNOG] powerful routers in core/edge routing/switching<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>What has port density, capacity or throughput got to do with routing?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Why do people with networks in a single geographic region, even if multi-homed, need to run default-fee? You know you can use a default route and a routing subset to achieve both redundancy and faster convergence? <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>I'm pretty happy with the current generation of hardware and where it sits price-wise. There have been a lot of good suggestions in the thread so I won't throw anymore in.There are cheaper and smarter ways to do things, but with smarts comes the risk that nobody else can support your tangled web of network magic.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Macca<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>From: </span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Joshua D'Alton <<a href="mailto:joshua@railgun.com.au">joshua@railgun.com.au</a>><br><b>Date: </b>Wednesday, 13 February 2013 11:06 AM<br><b>To: </b>"<a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a>><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [AusNOG] powerful routers in core/edge routing/switching<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>The problem is routing has lagged far behind switching in terms of port density, capacity, throughput etc. Obviously a switching engine is peanuts compared to a routing engine, but it is exaggerated by the massive amounts of features they put in routing engines. <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Seems to me we almost need a new breed of edge routers, ones that just talk BGP to other providers, and the current edge can stay as they are handling fancy things like MPLS which is really more of an internal routing, therefore switching, feature. Or not :)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>_______________________________________________ AusNOG mailing list <a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a> <a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>_______________________________________________ AusNOG mailing list <a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a> <a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></body></html>