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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Most businesses already have two copper
      pairs, i.e. phone + fax.<br>
      <br>
      You are right about residential customers though.<br>
      <br>
       - Guy.<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      On 19/10/2012 11:24 AM, Glen Greig wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAMj9cu=_X0djKBRMy8qDPRN1_WVL+Byg5fJTE-5bM=4sMxVMGQ@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">On the question about RIM optics, you have to keep in
      mind that a RIM is POTS only, to get DSL, an AM35 was shoehorned
      into the cabinet and used the RIM's multiplexer for backhaul.
      To upgrade the backhaul, it's not as simple as changing optics you
      need a completely new backhaul. CMUXs have the same issue, they
      have DSL capabilities, but the backhaul is just tacked on to the
      side of the POTS capacity. It may all seem like poor planning in
      2012, but back when these decisions were made, we were talking 20%
      takeup and 256Kbps plans.
      <div>
        <br>
      </div>
      <div>Bonding ADSL2+ may be a good small solution, but as a major
        rollout, you'll run out of copper pairs fairly quickly as every
        DSL line starts to require two or more pairs. </div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Glen<br>
        <br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 9:32 AM, ausnog
          (321) <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:ausnog@321.com.au" target="_blank">ausnog@321.com.au</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <br>
            We use VDSL Services from a carrier called FirstPath in the
            Sydney CBD areas, they have fibre fed DSLAM'S in buildings.<br>
            <div class="HOEnZb">
              <div class="h5"><br>
                <br>
                <br>
                -----Original Message-----<br>
                From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>
                [mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a>]
                On Behalf Of Mark Newton<br>
                Sent: Friday, 19 October 2012 10:17 AM<br>
                To: Guy Ellis<br>
                Cc: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:ausnog@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>
                Subject: Re: [AusNOG] VDSL2, was Re: 4G advances<br>
                <br>
                On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 10:12:43AM +1100, Guy Ellis
                wrote:<br>
                <br>
                 > I don't think we see a lot of VDSL2 in Australia
                because of the $  > investment required.<br>
                 > Also for line lengths > 2km ADSL2+ is almost as
                good.<br>
                <br>
                And because ACIF approval came too late to be useful.<br>
                <br>
                And because the NBN has been hanging over the industry
                like a sword of Damocles for the last five years, so
                nobody has been planning any major new fixed network
                rollouts, thereby denying Australian consumers the
                benefits of higher-speed technologies in the interim.<br>
                <br>
                  - mark<br>
                _______________________________________________<br>
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              </div>
            </div>
          </blockquote>
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      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <br>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
Guy Ellis
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:guy@traverse.com.au">guy@traverse.com.au</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.traverse.com.au">www.traverse.com.au</a>
T: +61 3 9386 4430 M: +61 419 398 234
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