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On 16/03/2012 1:28 PM, Scott Howard wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:CACnPsNU_49Qm9+3Qv=z-tsF5BfqP0aO9vnuA4ccEF-qhvL0v=g@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 7:05 PM, Paul Brooks <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:pbrooks-ausnog@layer10.com.au">pbrooks-ausnog@layer10.com.au</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">6to4 tunnels don't need
manual config.<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
6to4 tunnels also aren't really "tunnels" in the true sense of
the word. The gateway where the traffic exits the "tunnel"
will often be different to the one where it re-enters the
"tunnel". In reality, 6to4 is really an encapsulation
mechanism, not a tunnel.<br>
<br>
The figures from HE almost certainly count explicitly
configured tunnels only, not 6to4. (Based both on the context
on their website as well as the numbers)<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Which means the HE figures are conservative, and there are likely to
be a whole pile more people using mechanisms like 6to4 above and
beyond the real tunnel figures.<br>
I don't care if its not really a tunnel, and most end-users won't
either. I plug it in, power it up, and 20 seconds later my entire
household is IPv6 enabled while I shut the the cupboard door and
move on.<br>
Thats the way IPv6 enablement is *supposed* to be. <br>
<br>
Yes, unfortunately Optus doesn't peer locally, so my topologically
closest 6to4 gateway (well-known-anycast address 192.88.99.1) is HE,
even though PIPE run one locally:<br>
<br>
<tt>>tracert 192.88.99.1<br>
<br>
Tracing route to 192.88.99.1 over a maximum of 30 hops<br>
<br>
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1<br>
2 27 ms 14 ms 19 ms 10.85.0.1<br>
3 8 ms 13 ms 10 ms sbr5-ge2-1-4.gw.optusnet.com.au
[198.142.163.61]<br>
4 7 ms 11 ms 7 ms sbr3-ge14-0.gw.optusnet.com.au
[211.29.126.9]<br>
5 165 ms 165 ms 187 ms 203.208.191.61<br>
6 165 ms 171 ms 174 ms paix.he.net [198.32.176.20]<br>
7 176 ms 175 ms 167 ms 192.88.99.1<br>
<br>
Trace complete.<br>
</tt><br>
It would be completely awesome if a few other providers set up 6to4
gateways in-country!<br>
<br>
<br>
and for Julian, because its Friday:<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">6to4 tunnels don't need manual setup.<br>
<br>
A consumer-level Netgear N600 (WNDR3700), firmware V1.0.16.98,
IPv6 WAN mode set to 'Auto Detect'.<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.netgear.com/service-provider/products/routers-and-gateways/gigabit-ethernet-routers-gateways/WNDR3700.aspx">http://www.netgear.com/service-provider/products/routers-and-gateways/gigabit-ethernet-routers-gateways/WNDR3700.aspx</a><br>
<br>
Not exactly bleeding edge - reviews date back to 2009.<br>
<br>
After failing to detect native IPv6 (I'm on Optus HFC) it sets up
a 6to4 tunnel automagically - and when it does, a traceroute shows
the tunnel popping out in HE:<br>
<br>
router IPv6 page:<br>
<br>
<blockquote><tt>Internet Connection Type: Auto-Detect</tt><br>
<tt>Connection Type: 6to4 Tunnel</tt><br>
<br>
<tt><a tabindex="-1"
href="javascript:loadhelp('_IPv6_auto','wan_ipaddr')">Router's
IPv6 Address On WAN</a> 2002:dcef:69e5::1/16</tt><br>
<tt><a tabindex="-1"
href="javascript:loadhelp('_IPv6_auto','lan_ipaddr')">Router's
IPv6 Address On LAN</a>
2002:dcef:69e5:e472:c23f:eff:fe8d:7e40/64</tt><br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
traceroute from my WinXP desktop (just to to simulate a typical
end-user ;-) ) in Sydney. <br>
<br>
<blockquote><tt>>tracert -6 <a
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="http://www.vocus.com.au">www.vocus.com.au</a></tt><br>
<br>
<tt>Tracing route to <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="http://www.vocus.com.au">www.vocus.com.au</a>
[2402:7800:0:1302::2]</tt><br>
<tt>over a maximum of 30 hops:</tt><br>
<br>
<tt> 1 1 ms <1 ms <1 ms
2002:dcef:69e5:e472:c23f:eff:fe8d:7e40</tt><br>
<tt> 2 190 ms 165 ms 166 ms 2002:c058:6301::1</tt><br>
<tt> 3 169 ms 177 ms 190 ms
gigabitethernet4-16.core1.pao1.he.net [2001:470:0:13b::1]</tt><br>
<br>
<tt> 4 179 ms 177 ms 203 ms
paix.bdr01.sjc01.ca.vocusconnect.net [2001:504:d::86]</tt><br>
<tt> 5 180 ms 185 ms 177 ms
pos-1-0-0.bdr01.sjc01.ca.VOCUS.net.au [2402:7800:100:1::29]</tt><br>
<tt> 6 178 ms 177 ms 181 ms
pos-0-0-1.cor01.syd03.nsw.vocusconnect.net.au
[2402:7800:0:1::81]</tt><br>
<br>
<tt>etc.</tt><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
The point is, there is a stack of pent-up demand waiting for the
last piece to go into the jigsaw. Yes, the CPE vendors need to
support it, the transit providers need to route it, the ISPs need to
provide it, and the content sites need to advertise it, and without
all of those things it won't happen.<br>
<br>
But for those holding back - do you really want to wait until all
the other pieces are in place before you move, so that all the
eyeballs are on you when you flick the switch? Or would you rather
get in place early, precisely when nothing much will happen, and
then gradually deal with the issues as they occur before it is
supposed to be in production and supported - and while all the other
pieces fall into place, while the attention is focussed on a
bottleneck elsewhere.<br>
<br>
if you are the last piece to go into the jigsaw, you'd damn well
better fit perfectly first time, 'cause everyone will be watching
you.<br>
<br>
Paul.<br>
<br>
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