<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>All I have to say is:</div><div><br></div><div>Come on Curtis, show us the proof where it stated in the contracts that AINS had the right to take control of resource allocations / objects and properties?</div><div><br></div><div>If you can provide a signed agreement (with permission of all parties) that states this, I think all of us here will have nothing to say other than how wrong you guys are for doing route poisoning.</div><div><br></div><div>Either way, what you guys are doing is plain as day wrong, its pure child's play.</div><div><br></div><div>Commercial crap aside (I am interested purely in the technical aspects of this) </div><div>Last time I checked, BGP (Global Tables) was something that commercial entities were not permitted to manipulate for gain or malicious activities?</div><div><br></div><div>In other words, if your "CFO" / "CEO" / "Accounts and Billing" whatever dept told you to do this, is it not within your right to say "Hey guys, we can't do this, route poisoning is just wrong, you can't do it." ?</div><div><br></div><div>I am not really all up with legalities or anything else commercially, but I still think you should jump on and reverse your crap.</div><div><br></div><div>(Just my 2c)</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Loose cannons aren't meant to be trusted, that is all.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div><div><div apple-content-edited="true"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; 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-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(21, 33, 246); font-size: 12px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(21, 33, 246); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(5, 97, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 9px; font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(5, 97, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 9px; font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div><b>Cheers!<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Karl Kloppenborg</b></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#056100" size="1"><i><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(5, 97, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 9px; font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#056100" size="1"><i><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; "><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#056100" size="1"><i><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; "><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#1521F6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(5, 97, 0); font-size: 9px; font-style: italic; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(5, 97, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 9px; font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#056100" size="1"><i><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; "><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(5, 97, 0); font-size: 9px; font-style: italic; ">Please consider the environment before printing this email. Think before you print. </span></div></span></i></font></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#056100" size="1"></font></span></span><br></span></span></font></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#1521F6">
</font></span></i></font></div></span></i></font></div></span></span></i></font></div></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></div><b>[Disclaimer]: Unless otherwise expressed, my views / comments and thoughts on AusNOG have no relation to my employment or employers and are not the same views / comments or thoughts that they may have.</b></div><div><b><br></b></div><div><b><br></b><div><div>On 12/12/2010, at 16:39, Karl Auer wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Sun, 2010-12-12 at 15:11 +1100, Kurt Bales wrote:<br><blockquote type="cite">We have spoken with the management team at Alumina who have been<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">unable to find a contract that gave permission [...]<br></blockquote><br>There is a lesson in this for all of us: When arranging contracts,<br>ensure that network resources that are the property of or under the<br>administrative control of your company (as distinct from under the<br>operational control of your company) are specifically excluded from any<br>actions the other party is permitted to take in case of dispute. It<br>might even be wise to list the most important ones...<br><br>Regards, K.<br><br>-- <br>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<br>Karl Auer (<a href="mailto:kauer@biplane.com.au">kauer@biplane.com.au</a>) +61-2-64957160 (h)<br><a href="http://www.biplane.com.au/kauer/">http://www.biplane.com.au/kauer/</a> +61-428-957160 (mob)<br><br>GPG fingerprint: DA41 51B1 1481 16E1 F7E2 B2E9 3007 14ED 5736 F687<br>Old fingerprint: B386 7819 B227 2961 8301 C5A9 2EBC 754B CD97 0156<br>_______________________________________________<br>AusNOG mailing list<br><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br>http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog<br></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></div></body></html>