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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>All completely fair points and I hope I have not caused any
offence certainly none was intended, but to respond<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Yes the moment an email is committed it is no longer private, that
is common sense – it wasn’t about seeing titillating emails without
people knowing, nor was it about suggesting an “enemy of the state”
.. It is simply a case that there is a time and place, and I would argue that
cold calls by reporters upon receipt of any information when the intent of the
original poster is to assess an operational network affecting issue, and is in
the midst of trying to undertake that action, is not the correct choice of time
nor place. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The concept of a closed list, although brutal, would achieve in
most cases, a time delay element which is all that is necessary to assess,
investigate, resolve. It’s not about disclosure, its just the story can
wait, you’ll get your answers. We all hate when stuff breaks, and most
are happy to talk about it - In some lands, they might call this type of closed
list on operational issues “noc to noc” – hmmmm <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I believed from the charter, the list should promote lateral
communication between carriers on these topics. You state that we should barr
transgressors to the charter, but then suggest that it’s ok for media
folks to “bug” people for more info – So there is clearly a
very individualistic & fine line between how one perceives “leads”
.. I say, when you read something on the internet, which promotes you make an
journalist based telephone call – that is using a lead. But hey if I’m
wrong so be it. Perhaps the end result here is just an acceleration of that
which is already happening within the framework of process, and it is simply
these types of communications only go on behind closed doors.. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>… Maybe thinking along the lines of SP/telco lateral comms
– Could there could be a such a dreamy concept as AusNO<b>C</b> ? By in
large we already have shortcuts to each other through peering fabrics, why not
at the human discussion layer. Just some food for thought, I’m not
proposing a shoot down of AusNog, it certainly has its place, I’m just
thinking out loud with regards to how operational issues are discussed and responded
to by the people that have to deal with getting “bugged” when they
are trying to conduct fault resolution...<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net [mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Grahame Lynch<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, 14 April 2010 7:08 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Neil Fenemor<br>
<b>Cc:</b> ausnog@ausnog.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [AusNOG] List charter Vs Reporters on the list<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>If I can make a comment as a
member of the fourth estate and someone who tries to live by the charter, I
will make several points.<br>
<br>
1) Being on this list makes me more technically literate and helps improve the
quality of technology journalism in CommsDay. I'm sure you would all agree that
journalists all need help in that area.<br>
<br>
2) If someone transgresses the charter they should be individually barred. We
don't ban an entire racial minority from something because some people in their
group trangress laws. I live in Thailand and we are seeing the consequences of
that type of group think on the streets currently.<br>
<br>
3) The minute you commit something to email it is no longer private. The number
of forwarded private emails I get as a journalist is staggering. On AusNOG you
know I am here. A closed list? I might still see your titillating emails
without you knowing and no longer feel bound by your house rules. I probably
get forwarded over 500 "private" emails a year. People aren't very
ethical like that. Sad but true. If you decide to go all licentious in your now
"apparently closed list" emails you will probably get a bigger
audience not a smaller one.<br>
<br>
4) If ten people on this list say their Optus link is down I am not sure as a
journalist I would bug you for more info. I would bug Optus. That is not me
using the list for "leads", that is me making an observation that a
carrier probably should be asked for restoration information to help them
communicate to their customer base. I would probably find out from sources
other than this list anyhow.<br>
<br>
5) I was originally invited on to this list by a co-founder and I support
AusNOG's annual event through media promotion and other forms of support. I
would hate to be regarded as an "enemy of the state"<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
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