<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><br><div><div>On 25/03/2010, at 4:29 PM, Shane Short wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">As already pointed out, the cost to provide such a service would be extremely prohibitive-- I personally thing GPON was the only real, sensible solution, especially given that most of the opposition to the NBN seems to be cost related.</div></blockquote><div><br></div>Yep. I think no one has an issue with the idea of P2P being the best but only if it's actually viable to do. Ultimately the network will be a bit of a mix as residential get GPON, I'm sure the business side (paying more) will get PtP.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><br><div>There's no real point comparing australia to most other FTTx deployments in the world, our vastness and population density makes things much, much harder-- Poking around Wolfram Alpha, it turns out that The Netherlands (the entire country) is about half the size of Victoria alone and the population density is 488 people/km^2, where-as Australia is 2.77 people/km^2.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I think to be fair we'd need to work out the density/km^2 where we want to cover with FTTx. </div><div><br></div><div>MMC</div><div><br></div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div><br></div><div>-Shane<br><div><div><br><div><div>On 25/03/2010, at 1:41 PM, Curtis Bayne wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<!-- Converted from text/plain format --><p><font size="2">A commitment to a P2P network is one way to ENSURE open access is an option.<br>
<br>
DWDM over existing OF to exchanges = wavelengths between any two points in the same city for peanuts. Private, layer 2 networks between groups of people are possible without AGVC costs. 1Gbps drops to teleworkers - imagine the ability to build highly diverse private cloud infrastructure by dropping elastic compute nodes into your employees houses. No VPN. Total control. Out there, but not unachievable with this architecture.<br>
<br>
Perhaps you could use that old 155meg ATM gear you scabbed from work that sits in your garage/bits box doing nothing for a private link to your mum's house - the possibilities here are endless!<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a href="mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net">ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net</a> on behalf of Matthew Moyle-Croft<br>
Sent: Thu 3/25/2010 3:17 PM<br>
To: Bryn Loftus<br>
Cc: <a href="mailto:ausnog@ausnog.net">ausnog@ausnog.net</a><br>
Subject: Re: [AusNOG] NBNCo releases its response to industry consultation<br>
<br>
It's worth noting a few things about the Amsterdam experience:<br>
<br>
Their AVERAGE distance per service was 3 metres - 120km for 40k services. It's a fairly small geography they're building into which has a lot of MDUs. Guarantee the distance in Oz is a lot longer.<br>
<br>
It'd be nice to have a core or pair per house hold. But not at any expense.<br>
<br>
MMC<br>
<br>
On 25/03/2010, at 3:08 PM, Bryn Loftus wrote:<br>
<br>
This article (while very mainstream) has some interesting point on PON vs direct fibre- and some costs.<br>
<br>
<a href="http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/03/how-amsterdam-was-wired-for-open-access-fiber.ars">http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/03/how-amsterdam-was-wired-for-open-access-fiber.ars</a><br>
<br>
bryn<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 25/03/2010, at 3:23 PM, lists wrote:<br>
<br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Dasmo" <<a href="mailto:dasmo@dasmo.net">dasmo@dasmo.net</a>><br>
To: <<a href="mailto:ausnog@ausnog.net">ausnog@ausnog.net</a>><br>
<br>
Using PON is a bit short sighted.<br>
<br>
Why is that?<br>
<br>
It is power efficient ( less green house emmissions for the true believers)<br>
It can deliver 1Gb or more symentrical connections<br>
It can do L2 or L3<br>
<br>
I often see the argument against PON but I rarely if ever see reasons why, I<br>
would be interested to see the reasons why<br>
<br>
<br>
If you're going to spend the money to roll out a nationwide network, you<br>
might as well only do it once.<br>
<br>
The cost of point to point would make an already dubious business plan even<br>
less affordable.<br>
<br>
The biggest cost is not so much the cable as the duct access. In brownfield<br>
deployments that can be very high. $70 per meter is not out of the<br>
question. Duct access at $6 to $8 per year can add up to. If you put it<br>
on power poles then fine, but expect long delays when trucks trees and wind<br>
bring it down as will happen.<br>
<br>
<br>
regards<br>
<br>
Tim<br>
<br>
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Matthew Moyle-Croft<br>
Peering Manager and Team Lead - Commercial and DSLAMs<br>
Internode /Agile<br>
Level 5, 162 Grenfell Street, Adelaide, SA 5000 Australia<br>
Email: mmc@internode.com.au<<a href="mailto:mmc@internode.com.au">mailto:mmc@internode.com.au</a>> Web: <a href="http://www.on.net/">http://www.on.net</a><<a href="http://www.on.net/">http://www.on.net/</a>><br>
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_______________________________________________<br>AusNOG mailing list<br><a href="mailto:AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net">AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net</a><br><a href="http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog">http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog</a><br></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></div></div><span><ATT00001..txt></span></blockquote></div><br><div>
<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "><div>-- <br>Matthew Moyle-Croft</div><div>Peering Manager and Team Lead - Commercial and DSLAMs</div><div>Internode /Agile</div><div>Level 5, 162 Grenfell Street, Adelaide, SA 5000 Australia<br>Email: <a href="mailto:mmc@internode.com.au">mmc@internode.com.au</a> Web: <a href="http://www.on.net/">http://www.on.net</a><br>Direct: +61-8-8228-2909<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre; "> </span><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre; "> </span> Mobile: +61-419-900-366<br>Reception: +61-8-8228-2999 Fax: +61-8-8235-6909</div></span></div></span>
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