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<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>I see that most of the value to AU of building the NBN is
not delivering residential internet but in having</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>an access network that can deliver a decent rate at a
decent price. Most of the value (meaning valuable</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>to society) will be private networks of some sort (e.g your
local doctor being able to show your x-ray to</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>the specialist etc.)</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Better to do this lower in the stack rather than running
VPN over Internet (e.g. do it at L2.) Plus then
you</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>find it easier to wholesale.... Make it scalable by
connecting the OLTs (and whatever other broadband access</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>nodes you care to deploy such as DSLAMs, WiMax nodes etc)
to an MPLS backhaul network that provides</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>per retailer L2 or L3 backhaul VPNs. Hell, the OLTs
etc don't even have to be owned by NBN Corp as long as they</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>meet a minimum set of capabilities!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>The last thing I want to see is an NBN built over
a flat IP network. I guess I could run GRE tunnels
with</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>an MPLS shim inside that to provide a flexible transport
but then I have to worry about the final MTU. Please</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>don't send us down a path to RFC4623 pseudowire
fragmentation and reassembly!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Scott</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=333162004-29042009><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>(who has been delivering 802.3 EPON for a couple
of years now...)</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net
[mailto:ausnog-bounces@lists.ausnog.net] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Rob
Wise<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, 29 April 2009 1:55 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
ausnog@ausnog.net<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [AusNOG] Looks like the NBN will be a
PON variant for sure...<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>On Wed, Apr 29, 2009 at 10:12 AM, Mark Smith <SPAN
dir=ltr><<A
href="mailto:marksmith@adam.com.au">marksmith@adam.com.au</A>></SPAN>
wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote
style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">
<DIV class=im>Nick Brown wrote:<BR><BR>> Because from an ISP operational
perspective thats a horrible thought?<BR>> You lose the ability to shape
/ count / monitor traffic, in addition to<BR>> the increased support
because Joe next door has been browsing someone<BR>> else's $c
share.<BR><BR></DIV>Look up "IPoE" in Google (as silly as the acronym is),
all those<BR>problems have or are being solved (e.g. cable networks use
DHCP, and all<BR>the Ericsson DSLAMs that a lot of ISPs have are (and have
been for a<BR>long time) "IPoE" capable)). Cisco's ISG product can
apparently turn<BR>DHCP leases into RADIUS accounting records for
example.</BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV><BR>The extensive use of PPPoE/A and LAC/LNS in Australia is largely due
to the monopoly carrier situation and the requirement for wholesale access
(IMHO). In many other countries DHCP-based access is far more common
than PPP and all the usual features like Radius, shaping, ACLs, etc are still
available. I'd be surprised if you found a router vendor which did not
support DHCP based subscribers these days. <BR><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote
style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">In
a "native", not wholesale ADSL environment, the 8 byte
per-packet<BR>overhead and BRAS processing load, MTU issues and hair-pinning
of PPPoE<BR>encapsulated traffic are very expensive, when you consider that
the only<BR>real purpose of converting a multi-access medium like Ethernet
into a<BR>point-to-point virtual link is to be able to authenticate the
user. If<BR>you already know where they live (and DSLAMS can insert that
circuit-id<BR>in DHCP requests), why do you care what username / password
they use?</BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV><BR>Another model that is common is for each access port on the DSLAM /
ONT to be assigned a different VLAN on the trunk to the BRAS. This can
also allow for wholesale access by carrying the VLAN all the way through to
the retail provider at layer 2. With a PON it would be quite easy to
have multiple retailers access the same household and break out on different
ethernet ports on the back the ONT. Eg, internet on port 1, IPTV on port
2, voice on port 3, etc. The household could potentially take all these
services from different retail providers.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR><BR>Rob<BR>(who
was setting up a PON in the lab last
week)<BR></DIV></DIV><BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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